Beginner looking for rod, what to get....???

[Werloc]

Hi, I'm new to the forum and trying to learn to fly fish. My Dad was a "Die Hard" fly fisherman, and fly tyer. Just before he passed away 15 years
ago he was going to start to teach me how to fly cast. He was also tying up some flies for me which I still have. In those passed 15 years, I
haven't done much fishing until this passed Spring. My wife loves to fish, and last year she went a few times a week by herself while I was out
riding my motorcycle. Since my hours at work have been drastically cut, I now have time to fish, and can't afford to ride. I went to visit my Mom
and
ended up getting all of my Dad's fishing and tying gear. My wife and I have been trout fishing this year since a few weeks after opening day. I even
watched them stock on the N/B (NJ) where we do most of our fishing. We have a few good spots within 15 minutes of our house, which is great. Anyway, we
both really want to learn to fly fish in a very big way. I'm not happy with spin fishing rods, etc. Even if the fishing isn't good, we can have fun
perfecting our cast. Plus, the few fly fishermen that we see (and now know) catch a lot more than we do...lol. My Dad's old fly rod is a Kunnan
Graphite Advantage, 8'6", 6/7 wt. I have WF-6-F line on it. I tied a piece of orange yarn to the leader and we have been practicing on the grass at
the nearby park. I bought a few new leaders 2 weeks ago and we took the rod to the water. I tied on a nymph which looks like a brown #14 or 16
Hare's Ear and played with that. After casting for 20 or so minutes while working my way up stream to a slow moving pool, I caught a sunny. WOW, I
caught a fish..! What a rush for the first time. It was the most fun I ever had fishing. No trout, but happy as hell for the very first time in the
water with a fly rod. So now it was my wife's turn. She catches a smallmouth. We are now both very excited to move on and buy our own "first" fly
rods. I wanted to say everything I just did to give you and idea on how new to this we are, and where we're coming from. Also, since my wife went
from full time to part time, and my hours were cut at work, we don't have extra money to spend. I do have a few packs of 5wt. line, a few hundred
assorted flies (from Dad), and a few (ok to get by with for now) Pflueger Medalist reels.
So now, here is what I'm asking. With a budget of no more than around $200 maybe $250ish, for "Two" rods, what should we get. "Most" of our fishing
will be N/B & S/B of the Raritan. These places we also catch sunnies and smallmouth. I was doing some reading and thinking of a 5 wt line rod, 9'
long for each of us. I'm only 5'9", and my wife is 5'6", plus we wade in sometimes deep water. We need 2 new rods, and plan to upgrade in time. I
have it narrowed down to these 3 rods so far. The price is perfect for the St. Croix Triumph, or we can go for the Redington CT if it's better for
us. But prefer the price of the St. Croix. What rod, wt., and how long? Also, is there much difference between a 2 and 4 piece rod?

Here are the 3 rods:

Cabela's -- St. Croix Triumph® Fly Rod
Cabela's -- Redington™ Crosswater Fly Rod
Redington CT Classic Trout Fly Rods : Cabela's

Thanks for your help...

 

[BIGBOW]

With most rods you usually get about what you pay for, but since you're a beginner any of these should do the trick. I love my St Croix, but I paid a hell of a lot more for my model. I like the looks of the last Redinington CT rod, but dont know much about it. I can help with the size you need though. For the SB or NB I would advise a 8 or 9ft 4wt rod. But being a beginner, a 5wt will be easier to cast, so that choice is up to you. If you get hooked like most of us you'll eventually have rod sizes of all weights and line sizes.. enjoy.

 

[eddavidson9]

Of the 3 you listed, i'd go with the St Croix, but thats just me. Actually, for the price range, i'd go with LLBean Streamlight.

4pc rods are easier to transport but thats about it. There may be a slightly different feel between the 2 and 4 pc rods.

Since you already have the 5 wt lines that makes sense, 8'6" or 9' rods are standard. However, since you already have a servicable 6/7wt and a 6 wt line, you might consider alternatives. If you wanted to spread your options, in addition to a 5 wt you could get a lighter rod (3-4wt) for smaller streams/fish, or a bigger rod if you envision chasing larger fish down the line. Alternatively, you could continue to use the 6/7 (maybe invest in a WF7 line to help load the rod) for the time being and put more money into your initial purchase of a single 5wt. Then down the line when you upgrade/diversify again you can invest more into just one rod again.

Lot of options out there and just as many opinions. If you want to go the way you indicated in your post, again, i'd go with the triumphs.

 

[JeffK]

Good luck in your endeavors.

My first comment is not to sweat it - the beginning rods from reputable makers are all decent these days and will get you started without much frustration. After you fish a bit you will know more what you want from a rod, but just starting out a moderate action "beginners" rod is just fine. In fact, the smooth action and forgiveness of these rods never grows old IMHO. Redington and St Croix are both reputable rod makers and you wouldn't go wrong.

You already have a 6/7 wt that will do fine for ponds, smallies, streamers. I'm guessing now you want something lighter. What do you want that is different from the rod you have? Different length? Different weight? different speed? Figure out what you want that is different first in picking a new rod. I wouldn't say more accurate or longer distance until you are sure it is the rod and not your skills - most of flycasting is skills not equipment. Since you and your wife are both getting rods why not try two different lengths/weights? What about a 9' 5wt (a good all round rod with emphasis towards nymphing) and a 7 1/2' 4 wt, a lighter all rounder with a emphasis towards dries. That will give you a chance to switch back and forth and get a better idea of what lengths and weights work for you.

If money is an issue, try looking on Ebay, Craigs List, etc for used equipment. People are upgrading from their beginning outfits all the time. When December comes, look for TU chapters that have Christmas auctions. There is nowhere better to get used stuff cheaper than a TU auction IMHO, us TU guys are cheap. I'm a big Pfleuger Medalist fan - they are a great reel for the price. Some of the old Martins and other reels go for about $10 on the used market. In used reels you have to evaluate condition, but with a painted reel if the paint is fine and the reel turns smoothly it likely hasn't been abused.

With modern rods the 2 or 4 piece isue is solely about ease of traveling and price. Until recently there was a trade-off where the more piece rods were easier to carry, but didn't cast as smoothly. The joints in the rod (known as ferrules) now are so good you can't tell the difference in casting between a 2 and 4 piece rod and most people would go with the 4 piece rod if the price is the same. Some people object to the extra time it takes to put a 4 piece rod together, but IMHO that's about 30 seconds and doesn't make a real difference.

 

[Zonk]

I'd go with the 865-4 St. Croix Triumph if it was up to me.

While there are advantages and disadvantages of a 9' rod versus an 8.5' rod, being a beginner it wouldn't make much difference to you. Additionally an 8.5' rod is long enough for the rivers in the East.

With the modern ferrule technology there should be little if any difference in casting a 4pc versus a 2pc rod, but the 4pc will travel much better.

Plus St. Croix is a well known company. Should you decide to "upgrade" down the road you'll have no problem selling a St. Croix and using that money for a more expensive outfit.

I've test casted a St. Croix Triumph once before and was surprised at how well it casted for it's price.

Zonk

 

[Werloc]

Hey thanks guys. I was leaning towards the St. Croix since I've heard more about that brand rod over the Redington's although, getting 2 different rods makes very good sense. As far as 2 piece vers. 4 piece, that's good news that there isn't much difference in performance. I prefer a 4 piece rod since my Toyota pickup is small. Plus, we do a lot of trail walking to get to some spots away from the crowded/over fished areas. Sometimes we'll even use mountain bikes with backpacks. OK, so that's taken care of.

Let's talk about Pros & Cons of rod length. Why would one choose a 9' over an 8'..? Or and 8' over the 9'...? I've read a few fly fishing books (all
old from the 1980's) saying that a longer rod would be for longer casting, and/or if you sitting in a canoe (which we have and use sometime), or
wading in chest high deep water. This would be to help keep the line up higher out of the water while false casting. Does this matter or is this
just myth? I figured once we're better at casting, we would overcome these minor adjustments needed. That being said, that's why I told you how tall we are, and where we fish. I'm now thing just staying in the middle on length and getting 8'6" rods. I think we'll get 5wt rods since I already have new 5wt Orvis line, plus it's an all around use weight for Trout, Pan fish, Bass, etc. Like I said, I do have my Dad's old 6/7 wt rod, but I'd prefer to not use it unless we really need to. It's not worth much to others, but hey, it was my Dad's pride and joy. It's has a lot of sentimental value to me which can't be replaced. Also, no worries on being "Hooked". Believe me, we are. Over the passed few years, we have gone to KLG just to watch everyone fly fishing. While out on motorcycle rides I would stop up on the Big Flat Brook and watch. I've wanted to learn to fly fish since the early 80's. I'm now 47 years old and know that this is what I want to do. I also know that this is a lifetime of continuous learning. Would like to phase out the spinning rods completely. When times are better with money for us, we will have some experience under our belt, and will have better equipment, in all sizes we need. Just on a very tight budget right now. Looking to get our rods within the next week or two, and be better when the Fall season picks up for trout. Maybe some lessons before then also.

I was just thinking about landing a larger fish or getting it into my net. A shorter rod would be a little easyer, correct..?

Thanks again for all your help....

 

[Trouser Trout]

I prefer a 4 piece rod since my Toyota pickup is small.

Maybe once you get the whole rod thing squared away, you can treat yourself to an American made truck, like a Ford.

 

[BIGBOW]

The book was correct.. a longer rod and heavier line are easier to cast further with (and easier from a boat). That being said, my first rod was a 8ft 4wt and fit the rivers I fish just fine. I mostly hit small to medium sized rivers (like the ones you mentioned). On the 2 vs 4 piece, I try to get rods that break down to 4 pieces for convenient transport and backpacking.. never had one come apart while fishing. The St Croix will do you just fine if that is your choice.

 

[JeffK]

I have a slightly different take on length - longer helps you cast further until the rod gets so long that you can't control it. Sort of similar to a baseball bat. Bigger bats do hit the ball farther - if you can get it around and make contact. In fly rods length stops being a distance factor for most people about 9'. The bigger question is whether you need distance. Most stream fishermen in NJ don't need to cast far so the distance thing is something of a red herring. If you fish lakes, large rivers like the upper Delaware or saltwater then throwing a lot of line is important. In the trout streams of NJ accuracy takes precedence by a long shot over distance.

Now how does rod length affect accuracy? Shorter rods throw with more accuracy, but you can manage the line once it is on the water better with a longer rod. Therefore, the length issue and accuracy depends how you fish. I personally like a 7' to 7 1/2' rod for dry fly fishing where dropping the fly on target is important. I have rods down to 5' length, but below 7' IMHO they are somewhat gimmicky, specialty rods. I love to fish wets and Czech nymphs where much of the control happens once the flies hit the water. For these cases I like 10' rods. Once again, I have one-handed rods up to 13', but past 10' they are awkward specialty rods. The standard 8' to 9' rods fill a middle ground where you can do almost anything OK, but a special rod may do something better now and again.

Greater the weight the longer the distance. The old rule of thumb used to be that you can fish comfortably 10 feet for each weight. i.e a 3 wt is comfortable out to about 30 ft and a 5 wt is comfortable out to about 50 feet. This is very rough, but isn't a bad place to start.

And probably more important than line weight or rod length is skill level! (especially at first) The fine points of length and weight don't matter much until you reach a certain competency. A reasonable starting point for NJ streams is 7 1/2' to 9' with 4 wt to 6 wt rods. You will need to fish a long time before your equipment is the limiting factor if you start with a reasonable beginning outfit. However, fly fishermen are notorious gear heads. I guess we need an excuse other than operator error when we don't catch fish.

 

[Werloc]

Yeah, makes a lot of sense I learned that at the pistol range. We get guys in the club always shooting at the 50 & 75 yard range and never hit the damb target. I'll stay at the 15 to 30 yard mark and hit the bullseye every shot. I guess I'll get one 8' and one 8'6" or 9'. I'll see what I end up clicking on the day I order. I here ya on the "gear heads". I'm like that with guns. Gotta have the best, and a lot of'em.... Why do all of my hobbies have to be expensive..

 

[golden beetle]

Of the 3 you listed, i'd go with the St Croix, but thats just me. Actually, for the price range, i'd go with LLBean Streamlight.

4pc rods are easier to transport but thats about it. There may be a slightly different feel between the 2 and 4 pc rods.

Since you already have the 5 wt lines that makes sense, 8'6" or 9' rods are standard. However, since you already have a servicable 6/7wt and a 6 wt line, you might consider alternatives. If you wanted to spread your options, in addition to a 5 wt you could get a lighter rod (3-4wt) for smaller streams/fish, or a bigger rod if you envision chasing larger fish down the line. Alternatively, you could continue to use the 6/7 (maybe invest in a WF7 line to help load the rod) for the time being and put more money into your initial purchase of a single 5wt. Then down the line when you upgrade/diversify again you can invest more into just one rod again.

Lot of options out there and just as many opinions. If you want to go the way you indicated in your post, again, i'd go with the triumphs.

For the money, the LL Bean Streamlight rod/reel combo is the best. For about 200 bucks, you get a great rod, and a decent enough reel and line.

Enjoy if you buy it.

 

[Werloc]

I don't need reels. Looking to get 2 different brands. Still open to recommendations..

 

[golden beetle]

I don't need reels. Looking to get 2 different brands. Still open to recommendations..

Get an LL Bean Streamlight. Reel is a bonus$

 

[Pete]

If "made in USA" is a factor in your purchasing habits....

Check out the Diamondback Americana series.
It's reasonably priced. Mine is the "easiest to cast" of my graphite rods.

My review of the 9', 5-weight Diamondback Americana, 9 foot, 5-weight, made in USA - Fly Tying Database!

 

[Werloc]

How about the action? I see most beginner/entry level rods are med/fast action. How would a medium action be? I guess it wouldn't really matter for us since we don't know one from the other from experiance. I'm really starting to fall in love with this rod. What do you think for a first rod?

Redington Classic Trout Series Fly Rod Review - New England On The Fly

Maybe one of those in a 4wt., and the St. Croix in a 5wt and different length. Man, I don't know. So many to choose from. Ask 10 different people and get 10 different answers.

 

[Trouser Trout]

Just by a rod already.... the reality is any 4-5-6 wt rod, will suffice for your first rod, most of your casts will be inside of 50'. Fly selection and presentation are and will always be far more imprtant than the name on your fly rod.

 

[Werloc]

Yeah, your right. I'm over thinking this.

 

[Future Fanatic]

Just by a rod already....

Yeah... Just don't make a really huge mistake when you do...

 

[JeffK]

A lot of us old-timers really prefer a medium or slow action - that is why more and more people are picking up a bamboo or fiberglass rod which are generally slower actions than graphite rods.

The medium action is more forgiving of poor timing - that is a big reason why it is recommended for newbies.

The medium or slower actions also allows one to feel how the line loads the rod better - another plus for a beginner.

However, no matter how long you fish plenty of anglers like the feel you get from a softer rod. More forgiving and better feel are things that never grow old to me. Finally, medium rods have a slower stroke that is more relaxing to me. I fish to relax and slowing down helps me have a chill evening and observe what is going on around better. IMHO, that is one minus for a newbie since most guys want to start whipping the rod around right away and find it hard to slow down and let the rod do the work.

Fast rods can cast farther in skilled hands - most of us don't have the casting skills to take advantage of that. Sometimes a faster rod helps me on a windy day.

I like fast rods in shorter lengths for punching casts under trees and into tight spots. I also like somewhat fast rods for nymphing so that I can react quickly for the hookset.

All these comments are personal preferences - your mileage may vary. Listen to other people's comments to open your eyes to the possibilities and then use what works for you.

 

[Werloc]

Hey thanks. Yeah, today I met up with an old friend that has been fly fishing for over 20 years. Although we were'nt near any water, he had his rod in his truck. About a 5 year old Orvis rod, don't remember the model. Anyway after talking a while he insisted I try it in the yard. Wow, very light for a 5 wt and what a "huge" difference from the old rod I'm using now. This rod felt like an ultralight compared to mine. Mine feels like a big heavy surf rod....lol Never knew what a good rod felt like. Now very excited to get the new rods. My wife loved it too. She noticed the difference right away. We're most likely going to get 2 of those med. action Redington CT rods in 5wt., 8'6". He told us he would take us out when we get them. Had a very good day today.

Thanks for all the replies guys. I really appreciate all your imput.....

 

[CatskillKid]

Greys, Hardy, SAGE or Winston. My preference would be get something you will grow into, like a Sage FLI. Dollar for dollar it's pretty darn good. Winston makes an enrty level rod for 200 that will also knock your socks off as compared to most others, if not all of them.