C&F Design Fly Boxes

[dcabarle]

I'm sitting here looking at my C&F fly boxes. I have quite a few of them that range in price from 34.00 - 49.00. Although I love these things for their size, weight, and well... the overall design on quite a few models tend to make things pretty convenient too, they are pretty damn pricey! For those of you who don't own one of these toys, you get a 100% Plastic shell with foam inserts. I'd have to say that each box could probably be made with the same amount of plastic as 1 or 2 two liter bottles of coke. Let's see, that's .79cents per bottle on sale. Take the Coke out and the bottles alone I'm sure are a fraction of that cost. As for the foam... It holds my flies nicely. Occasionally a fly or two will be out of place, but it's so rare that this happens, I'm not sure it's even worth mentioning.

Anyhow, I personally can't see the total combined foam in all of my boxes, costing more than say.... .25 cents? So maybe I'm exaggerating a bit. Whatever the cost for the materials, R&D, and I would say advertising, but how often do we see advertising for this company? Very rarely, right? So, are these boxes worth 34+ dollars? Considering I just got done raving about light weight and convenient they are, I'd have to say that they are worth every penny of the 34+ you'll pay for one.

How many of you own these boxes and what are your overall opinions on them starting from cost to features and functionality.

Once you get over the cost, how could you not love these little things?

 

[RickW]

I dont have any C&F boxes. They are pretty spendy. I may try one tho' to see how the treader boxes work. The old peepers ain't what they used to be

 

[dcabarle]

Rick,

I use the threaders for show, but for kicks, I've tried them out and they work like a charm. If your eyes are that bad, you'll want to load the threaders up with flies under some good lighting. Because the threaders are made from metal wiring, it's much easier to poke them through the eye of the hook. On the downside, if you get the micro threaders, you've gotta be careful because if you're too rough with them, they will break. No need to fear though, they sell replacement packs. How convenient.

Load your threaders up under good lighting and you shouldn't have a problem. When you're on the river and your need a fly, it doesn't get any easier.

 

[RickW]

Thanks Dennis,
There's nothing more frustrating than fading light, a good spinner fall, and fumbling with reading glasses, magnifiers, etc while trying to thread a new fly on.

 

[Muddler Minnow]

Sounds very interesting

Dennis:

You have piqued my interest in these pricey little boxes. I do not own any (primarily because of cost) but I do own small adjustable boxes, Meiho waterproof boxes, floating nylon ripple/flat foam etc. none of which I paid more than $15.00 for. The threader feature also sounds interesting especially now that we are approaching Trico season and size 20+ flies are getting tougher to use/thread every year.(at least for me)

Thanks for the education/recommendation. Maybe I'll try one!

What are other anglers favorite boxes.? I'd also be interested in knowing that (mine up until now has been the floating nylon covered foam ripple/flat box with magnetic latch that Orvis/others sell).

MM

 

[flyin]

Rick,

I use the threaders for show, but for kicks, I've tried them out and they work like a charm. If your eyes are that bad, you'll want to load the threaders up with flies under some good lighting. Because the threaders are made from metal wiring, it's much easier to poke them through the eye of the hook. On the downside, if you get the micro threaders, you've gotta be careful because if you're too rough with them, they will break. No need to fear though, they sell replacement packs. How convenient.

Load your threaders up under good lighting and you shouldn't have a problem. When you're on the river and your need a fly, it doesn't get any easier.

although I haven't gone fishing with them much, I got the C&F box with the midge threaders
exactly because my eyes are bad and they do work like a charm.

I agree about the price, though I happened to get my box on sale for about $20 which
is why I bought it! Even that is high for what you get. But that's flyfishing gear. Small market, specialized design == high price. (plus generally folks with too much money
willing to spend... but mostly just market forces at work).

 

[JasonM]

I still am using a richardson chest box, but I so a really cool idea for the c&f boxes. This was taken from the flyfishers paradise web forum.

RBF's C&F Chestbox Specifications - Two C&F Design Waterproof boxes with Flip Parts Dividers. Glue the blasted boxes together with JB Weld. Or you may use 3M double-side automotive trim tape for a more versatile, but less durable box. Add two split rings and attach Crooked Horn Outfitters' Bino-System for straps and you have a light, waterproof, weatherproof, non-glaring box that will carry over 1000 flies. You can add simple hinges by using #30 backing (black) but make sure you silicone the drilled holes to keep it waterproof.

 

[CR]

I love the C&F boxes, but have never thought about the high price until you pointed it out. It's totally true, the plastic probably costs next to nothing. But then again, how much does the graphite cost in a high end rod? Probably no more than the graphite in a cheap rod. It's in the details, I guess.

 

[RickW]

It's in the details, I guess.

Truedat

What you pay for is innovation. If the design is new and good, eventualy someone will start making knock-offs, or change the design a little and compete heat to head.

 

[dcabarle]

Jason,

Nice little idea you've got there. I can see keeping one for nymphs and dries and the other for streamers and large terrestrials. That would cover just about anything one would ever need.

Truedat

What you pay for is innovation. If the design is new and good, eventualy someone will start making knock-offs, or change the design a little and compete heat to head.

That's true... I never thought of that one. On the other hand, take a Wheatley box and compare it to an Okuma box. There's no comparison (That's of 2 years ago, that may have changed since the last time I looked.) You can get the Okuma version of a Wheatly for about 3/4 of the price.

 

[The_Sib]

C&F

I've got 2.
Love 'em.
Want to get some more.
Wish they came in more ( subtle ) colors ( like olive or tan ) besides varying shades of grey.
I am currently, and plan to use them further to categorize by fly type: mayfly, caddis, terrestrials, nymphs, streamers, wets, etc.

Cost is high but if you want a Cadillac or Mercedes, ya gotta pay.
Look at how pricey the Richardson's are.......

 

[Flyfisherman128]

Your Kidding

I use the C&F watertight boxes they are heavy duty and they lock closed you can get them for about $40 or so, great purchase I have 5 of them. The threader boxes are another story I own 3. Be serious guys these things are over priced pieces of junk. they don't close right 90% of the time and you have to struggle with them on the stream, the flies hook each other they are a pain and for your $40 you get like 3 threaders then you have to buy more at $14 a set. The threaders themselves, wouldn't leave home without them. I bought the threader card for the watertight boxes when alls said and done they cost about $5.00 more and you can hold twice the flies and you have something that is going to protect your investment. I know the discussions about water tight verses non water tight all that aside, The C&F threader box too much money.

 

[dcabarle]

I have a bunch of the little boxes (5) and 2 of the big boxes. I've never had a problem with the flies getting caught up. I think that once you get used to closing the little boxes, they are ok. No doubt they don't close right the first time every time, but they are still lightweight and convenient. I've never had to actually wrestle one closed though! Ok, and yes, they are probably a little overpriced too.

 

[Flyfisherman128]

yup

Lightweight yes, no doubt. I'm just saying that in comparison to others they are just not worth the money when you can buy other C&F products that seem to be of better quality for nearly the same $$$. The other thing is the non watertightness. I often push the limits of my waders and end up with my boxes under water, the watertight box keeps you from getting all your flies washed. I have a box I picked up at a show for $16 Its called Cliff's Fly box its very nice for the money but it has its drawbacks too.

 

[Scott]

Here's why they are so expensive: All plastic parts, especially injection molded ones that are more complex than a blow molded item (such as a plastic coke bottle) are made from a mold. Dies can be fabulously expensive - they can run into millions of dollars EACH.

Looking at the CF boxes, it would not be unreasonable to estimate a mold cost of $50,000 per mold, and that is probably on the low side. So if they are making five sifferent sizes, you're looking at $250,000 worth of dies. Now factor in the dies used to cut the foam, the dies for the little fly wires, and the assmebly equipment and you could be looking at $1.5 Million + for a capitol investment of the machinery.

In order to recover this cost, you have to price the product to account for the cost of the equipment, cost of the plastic resin, cost of assembly, shipping, sale, marketing, administrative costs, etc.

The more you make, the lower the cost. That's why easy-to-make blow molded parts like coke bottles are relatively inexpensive, they pump out millions of them. As such the depreciated cost of production equipment is lower per unit. As such if you are only making a few thousand of something a year, your cost will be much higher per unit.

Don't think plastic is cheap either, the cost of all plastics has tripled in cost in just the last couple of years.

So no, it's not just a few cents worth of plastic. There's more there than meets the eye.

 

[C&R]

I have a bunch of the little boxes (5) and 2 of the big boxes.

Dennis, what size are your big C&F boxes? I only have one smaller C&F box and want to purchase some larger ones, but can't seem to find a larger version of the micro-slit model. Reason I want the larger one is that I recently picked up a Fishpond Gore Vest and the pockets are deep so I'd like to utilize as much space as possible. My large Morell boxes fit nicely (4" x 6.5") with some room to spare so that's kind of what I'm looking for in the C&F.

According to the SA website, all micro-slit models have the same dimensions (4.88" x 3.70" x 1.25"), they just vary in the number of rows and hook sizes they can accomodate. Basically an 8-row box is the same as a 14-row box.

 

[Eagle Claw]

Does anyone know if they make some type of carrier for the inserts. I would like the boxes a lot better if I could have say 15-20 inserts with diferent fly selections to suit the season that could be just pulled out of a master box and inserted into the smaller box. That way you would have your own little portable fly shop in your car.

 

[Harry]

C&R:
They make the C&F boxes in a 4 1/2 w x 7 3/4 t x 1 5/8 thick, just looked at them online at the Fly Hatch and Feathercraft.


Eagle Claw:
They have a system fly file that holds 6 standard inserts, saw that in the Feathercraft catalogue.

______________________
"Quit Wishing" "Go Fishing"

 

[sandfly]

I have a few C&f boxes and like the way they hold the flies too. I also got some foam and added slits to it and made my own type...as for the richardson boxes, I bought a downs fly box from E.Hille years ago a cheaper(plastic) type of chest box than the richardson for around 50.00, i think they are somewhere around 80.00 now..I like them better, as they are colored green and blend in with the envioment..plus its easy to change trays..

 

[NJflyfishR]

Im thinking of getting a C&F fly box. I was wondering what box would you get for Catskill Drys? I was thinking of getting the water proof series box in 12 or 16. Anyone have any suggestions.

Thanks

Tight-Lines
Rick

 

[Corndog]

DC,

I have 4 and they are the best fly boxes I've ever used. Got my first one from a fishing bud for my bday. You wanna get a fishing bud a great gift, a C&F box is it.

I agree with the cost being outrageous, but it's so much better thay any other box I've seen I'll pay the price.

I have buds that have them with the Orvis label on them and they paid ten bucks more for the same box just to get the Orvis name on theirs. If we'll pay their high prices, why would they even consider lowering the cost?

Gander Mountain and Ramsey Outdoors carries most of the boxes and inserts.

EC, one of my buddies has the insert carrier. So I know their out there somewhere.

Sib, Orvis sells the same boxes in an off white almost tan color.

I love the compartment box that has magnets in the bottom to keep your loose flies from falling out or blowing out on a windy day, but my favorite is the midge box with the threaders.

Cdog

 

[Andy]

My C&F #1506 was made in Japan which might account for a higher labor cost than we've become accustomed to in recent years. I'm also thinking that die-cutting those corrugated foam strips and slits might be a tricky operation. Maybe they're precision laser-cut with some kind of expensive machine. Once the knock-offs start arriving from China I'm sure we'll see a price reduction. I just hope quality doesn't suffer with a price reduction.

 

[Wbranch]

I have three with the middle swing page, two with the micro slits for a couple hundred flies, and one for eggs. I love the tightness of the slits and for flies #16 - #22 I just can't think of a better way to store and protect them.

 

[Corndog]

I just picked up another C&F midge box at Gander Mountain in Middletown, NY for $29.95. That's a savings of at least $15.00. They have all of their C&F/Orvis boxes on sale. Not many left.

You're right WB, their the best for tiny flys.

Cdog

 

[Andy]

C&F knockoffs are available. Same basic principle but slightly different design. I bought one measuring 4 7/8" X 3 5/8" with four hooking surfaces (has a leaf) for $17.50 at Catskill Flies last season. Yes, it's made in China!

 

[AKSkim]

That looks outstanding!

Very nice.

 

[Wbranch]

Hello AK,

Thank you for the compliment. Here are a few close-ups of a few of the boxes.

#1 - Dorothea spinners & emergers
#2 - PMD emergers

 

[Harry]

Years ago you could buy the additional center page for these boxes and then they went away. Rio now has the rights and has started marketing them again.

 

[trico mike]

I really like the ones that the foam comes out of. You can use different pages for diffrent rivers or times of year without having to buy 20 boxes. That being said I have 6 small boxes and one large one . Love them all.

 

[mikep]

I see that you store your dry flys in them. Doesn't the hackle get crushed?