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open space
- Thread starter tompg
- Start date
Rusty Spinner
Active member
This is a giant poop sandwich regardless of which way folks vote. We can't rob Peter to pay Paul, but that's exactly what this proposes to do. A no vote means zero funding for new open space acquisitions and a yes vote means no funding for the Division or State Parks to maintain what they have....
We need truly dedicated funding that allows for both, not one or the other. NJ voters have approved a relatively small amount of their tax dollars to fund open space since the 1960s and it has been bipartisan. Wish we could have followed that model again. This one is all about presidential politics ahead of the '16 election....
We need truly dedicated funding that allows for both, not one or the other. NJ voters have approved a relatively small amount of their tax dollars to fund open space since the 1960s and it has been bipartisan. Wish we could have followed that model again. This one is all about presidential politics ahead of the '16 election....
It is my limited understanding that we would take money used for cleaning up environmental messes and use to fund open space. I'm torn on this one. Does open space benefit land owners with tax breaks or make more useable space for everyone? Do I want to clean up the Passaic or keep the little trout streams clean and protected? Wish I didn't have to choose.
Anyone else see the debate this way?
Anyone else see the debate this way?
Rusty Spinner
Active member
Both. Much of the Green Acres funds are used to outright purchase lands and not just Farmland Preservation. Almost all of our state WMAs and Parks and Forestry lands came from Green Acres funding. And those lands require upkeep which will be stripped from the CBT if we vote yes. One alternative is to vote no now and hope to work something out with the legislature in the next fiscal year or when Christie leaves office.
For what little it's worth, I'm taking a bite out of the poop sandwich and voting yes. But I have a lot of friends that think just like I do on open space that are voting no. This is not a cut and dry issue as it always was in the past.
Rusty Spinner
Active member
In the interest of full transparency, I voted for Christie twice and I continue to generally support his efforts to rein in taxes on NJ citizens because we grew out of control. However, this is one tax I have always supported paying and have voted yes on every open space ballot initiative I could while living in this state over the years at various times.
I am surprised that the Democratic legislature didn't get this (open space, not using the CBT funds) on the ballot. To me, it proves what most of us have thought all along which is that Christie is running for POTUS and he needs to show as much tax cutting as he can given his having had a D controlled legislature all along.
golden beetle
Active member
Good reasoning, actually...
Trout Nazi
And...Boom goes the dynamite.
This bill really is crap. Given that I use our 2 biggest state parks on a weekly basis, I'm voting no.
FIN-ITE 34
Well-known member
Sit down and shut up. :boxing:
What are the chances that after the Round Man is gone, we revert back to the old system of funding open space?
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
I
What you neeed is john corzine. He believes in open space...and embezzling and pay to play. Maybe jim mcgreevey will come back
What you neeed is john corzine. He believes in open space...and embezzling and pay to play. Maybe jim mcgreevey will come back
FIN-ITE 34
Well-known member
The question was a serious one MAC. Can the funding for open space go back to the old system in a new administration? I don't care who that might be, I just want to know how long lived this vote will make the change.
CTobias
Professional BS'r
These guys are evil, yet the left loves George Soros. You know, the guy who sold out his own people to the Nazis.
CTobias
Professional BS'r
It can always go back to the way it was if you get the legislation passed.
mob201
Joe's Hopper
Huh... does anybody make that claim except for Ann Coulter and other right wing nutjobs? Just curious.
I don't love George Soros, but as far as I'm aware, he was 14 when it happened and he really had no choice if he wanted to survive. To compare that to the Koch brothers doesn't make any sense.
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
Jeez I hope you are not serious, he advocates for an open society with strict government controls. He has caused currency manipulation that damaged the British pound. Sorry but he is bad news just like like most guys with this level of power and influence
Rusty Spinner
Active member
Yes, and I'm surprised the Dems couldn't make that happen this time around.....
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
the old or current system is periodic referendums to feed the open space funds. The last one was 2009
Green Acres funding battle intensifying in scramble for votes - NJ State News - NorthJersey.com
Green Acres funding battle intensifying in scramble for votes - NJ State News - NorthJersey.com
mob201
Joe's Hopper
not the point macboob - I have no love for the guy as I already said. Nor does the left actually. The truth is, nobody cares about this guy except for glen beck, who mounted an insane conspiracy theory against him for years.
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
I meant is it state funded or do the counties have their own programs.
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
I
Your kidding. The left doesn't like him
Stop with your silliness.
Steven Spielberg and George Soros Stock Senate Democratic Super-PAC - Bloomberg Politics
Your kidding. The left doesn't like him
Stop with your silliness.
Steven Spielberg and George Soros Stock Senate Democratic Super-PAC - Bloomberg Politics
mob201
Joe's Hopper
What's the question here? Does he donate gazillions of dollars to liberal causes and the Democratic party? Is that the question? Everybody knows that to be true. Who's silly? You're silly.
Is he a darling of left-leaning Americans? The answer is no. He's a behind-the-scenes money guy.
CTobias
Professional BS'r
CTobias
Professional BS'r
Wait a minute I thought....
Hmm...seems like a person who is making an investment into something would want a return on that investment.
"behind the scenes money guy"
He is exactly everything the left stands for and you can't even begin to deny it. Do you think those politicians are working for you and the little man when billionaires like George Soros are funding their campaigns?! I think that air pollution in NYC is clogging up your brain.
lightenup
A fan of Boobery
We did a fund raiser at MacDonald's for a piece of property along a fine wild trout stream in NJ.....I don't remember the year........there were public funds involved, but mostly private donations.....some people have a lot of fucking money.......!!!!!!!!
Anyway, we raised enough money to help, the property was protected and there is public access to a crappy stream with one or two wild trout in it...win win....
I am completely torn on what to vote...anyway, the title led me to believe we were discussing the area between Mac's ears...
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
We did a fund raiser at MacDonald's for a piece of property along a fine wild trout stream in NJ.....I don't remember the year........there were public funds involved, but mostly private donations.....some people have a lot of fucking money.......!!!!!!!!
Anyway, we raised enough money to help, the property was protected and there is public access to a crappy stream with one or two wild trout in it...win win....
I am completely torn on what to vote...anyway, the title led me to believe we were discussing the area between Mac's ears...
Haha you still live in NJ. I think we know where the open space between the ears resides!!!!
lightenup
A fan of Boobery
The average taxes in the county you live in is what I pay also.....NJ isn't bad if you buy smart..MacBoob
MACFLY
Too many streams too little time
A quick look at city data indicates you are once again incorrect. Your counties median property tax bill is about 9k. My county is sbout 4900. Go catch a sucker you boob
Rusty Spinner
Active member
True, but then most everyone in your county drives 1 1/2 to 2 hours each way into NJ to work, negating that tax savings in gas and wear and tear on your cars
