Will cheap, low quality line hold me back in the learning process?

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just out of curiosity, I was wondering whether the type/quality of line makes a significant impact on casting. I'm well aware that getting a higher quality line is not going to suddenly make me a pro, but I was wondering whether having cheap line like the one I'm using now presents an obstacle to the learning process.

Right now I am fishing the most basic line that Cabela's makes. I'm not sure what it's called but it's a WF-5-F. It might be the combo pack listed on their site, but I can't be sure. All I know is that it came bundled with a Stowaway 5-piece travel rod and Prestige Plus reel.

I broke the tip section of the rod and I purchased as a replacement a Ross Worldwide "Essence FW" 5wt rod. It's a medium-fast action rod that fishes very differently from the Stowaway and I'm still getting used to the action on it.

I know that my technique is pretty flawed and I am still very much in the learning process so I know that many of the problems I'm experiencing (short distance casting, slack in the line when it hits the water) are because I am new to the sport. But I have also noticed that the tip of the line starts sinking pretty soon after I start fishing, probably less than an hour into a session. It also makes quite a bit of noise going through the eyelets and seems to drag somewhat.

I was hoping to get some feedback from people here as to whether it's worth it to invest in another line. Will it be hard for me to improve on this setup or am I better off just working on getting better with this before I move up to something of higher quality? Thanks in advance

-gonzo

 

[trico mike]

You dont have to have the most expesive line to make your casting better but a mid grade line may help abit such as a rio 60$. Rember to clean the line before each outing it will reduce the drag and the noise you are hearing. The one thing that will help is to figure out what kind of caster you are and to get a rod that fits your style. Testout rods at shops to accomplish this. Personally i have a very slow stroke and i like to feel the rod load. Once again you dont have to spend a ton of money but get something that feels good. One other suggestion to improve your casting is to get a line one weight heavier then your rod this will really let you get the feel for the casting stroke. Good luck

 

[Agust]

One of the main things I advise folks buying outfits and combo packages is to consider replacing the line as soon as viable. Most combo packages come with shorter and often unusually tapered lines. Combo packages usually cut corners on aesthetics and trim, some of these make no difference in performance like quality of cork, or plastic vs. wood reel seat or click reel vs. disk drag. But some packages use lines that are only 80 feet long instead of 90, resulting in shorter tapers and that does affect casting.

You can get a decent Cortland or Sci Anglers or even Orvis for $25-$50 and "premium" lines for from $60-$100. For the most part folks new to the sport won't see much difference between the $40 line and the $100 line, but they normally see a big difference from the "package line" and a new "regular" line. Some of that is just because the new line is clean, and some because the new line is tapered differently.

Also while many experienced caster prefer a WF for distance casting, a Double taper is better for most roll casting, and casts around 30-40 feet. Which is where most of your casting will occur. In addition a DT can be turned around when it starts to wear, since most wear occurs in the first 30 feet. WF lines can only be used in one direction as they are only tapered at one end. I personally like long taper lines like the Rio windcutters and Wulff Triangle Tapers, but these are often harder for beginners to cast well and can lead to frustration.

If budget does not allow purchasing a new line immediately, make sure you clean the line more frequently. First because grit affects the casting, second because the grit and dirt on your line will cause excessive wear on the guides.

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

thanks for the input! I might get something this week as I have plans to fish the Esopus and possible Schocharie this coming weekend, depends on what kind of deals I can find.

I was at the Orvis store yesterday and saw that they've got some lines on sale, but I don't really know that much about them. I've heard good things about Scientific Anglers, don't know much about Cortland. I guess it's probably a matter of personal preference. I will think about the dual taper idea but at this point I'm just starting to get used to WF and I don't want to mess myself up right before a fishing trip.

 

[Pete]

You mentioned that the line floats... then the tip starts sinking..

Either:
The line needs cleaning...
OR
Water is entering the "core" cauing it to sink.
OR
Both

Make sure the end of the line is sealed.
This is commonly done by coating the line-to-leader connection with rubber cement, Knotsense, or equilivent. If the line has a pre-made loop on the end, this may not be a factor, but make sure the core isn't exposed.

 

[JeffK]

Sometimes even better lines have too long a front taper and you need to cut it back a little. However, be careful since it's tougher to splice in a new taper then cut it off.

I am torn on the cheap line vs good line. There are only a few manufacturers of fly line, so I think the cheaper lines are all similar. Level line wouldn't cut it, but Double Taper (DT) or Weight Forward (WF) should work out. They are extruded over a synthetic line core in series and then cut to length. The tip can be long since because of cutting tolerance. Taper doesn't cost money, but more careful cutting and better materials do. After a point fly lines are personal. I like the old Cortland 444 DT in peach. Scientific Anglers, Rio, and Royal Wulff all make good lines in my experience. Never used on Orvis line.

Cleanliness is key. You pick up more algae, dust, grit etc than you realize fly fishing. All sorts of gunk is in the surface film. Most people don't clean their lines enough.

Just something to think about, I have been fishing with newbies a fair amount lately and the biggest problem I see is rushing the cast - especially the final cast. Take it easy, let the line pay all the way out and than do a nice smooth forward stroke and let it pay out smoothly. Don't whip the rod back and forth. I often see the false casts going nicely and then the caster whips the final cast to get it out and loses all the smoothness. Go with the flow. The timing will be faster for shorter casts since it takes the line less time to straighten out the shorter it is. It is harder to get the feel for shorter casts since the weight of the line is less so it is harder to feel.

Finally, slack is usually good! Controlling the amount of slack is the key, but you generally need some.

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

there's no loop on the end of the line. I'll clean it this week and see if that helps. thanks

 

[The_Sib]

See what Pete said.....Seal the end.

MAKE SURE the line is completely dry.

HINT, do this before you clean the line

there is a natural "wicking" action that draws water into the core.
In freshwater lines in many cases, the core is braided.

 

[NJDrew]

In my limited experence, I found that the Orvis "Premium" flyline I started out with actually did hold me back later on. When I switched over to Scientific Anglers Mastery Trout WF-4-F I notice a consitant improvement in my cast. With that said, there are so many factors that will affect your cast its hard to pin down just one. More often then not, it a combination of a few things that work against you.

 

[Petergoodman]

What type of fishing you like also counts. For example, when I originally got my Winston rod maybe 18 years ago the recommended line was a Sci Anglers Ultra3. When that wore out, also on recommendation got a Cortland Laserline - which cast much farther, but stunk when it came to short casts of 20 feet or roll casting. This being a problem for me, as this was the kind of fishing I like to do. If most of my fishing was on the Big D or out west on something like the Madison, different issue. So first decide realistically how you like to fish. The 444 Peach someone mentioned is what I ended up with - not a cannon line, but great for dropping a #18 dry 15 feet away in an eddy. Depends on what you want.

 

[klg neighbor]

A wise man once said......

If I had a nickel... WULFF TRIANGLE TAPER!!!!

 

[biggerthomas]

I like the SA Nymph line Nymph

and also the Rio Nymph line Fly Lines, Fly Leaders, and Fly Fishing Accessories - Rio Nymph

Both help me make accurate casts and turn flies over easily. I find the SA doesn't accumalate as much algae but maybe that's my imagination...

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

thanks guys for all the input. I'm going to start by cleaning my line and seeing how it fishes when I head up to the Esopus this weekend. If it doesn't float better after cleaning and sealing the tip and if my casting doesn't start improving soon I will looking for a replacement. What's the best way to clean a fly line?

 

[trico mike]

There is alot of good cleaners on the market but for a quick fix put some armorall on a cloth and run the line thru it. Always works in a pinch but not recomended to do all the time.

 

[afishinado]

I ruined several of my fly lines using Armorall. Different line mfgs use different types of plastic to make their lines. One line cracked in short order, one became soft and sticky, and a third line was okay. Using Armorall is like playing Russian roulette with your line – it can either work or destroy your line. By far, the best line cleaner / dressing I’ve found is Zip Cast. It cleans well and leaves a slick coating (of Teflon I think). Unfortunately, the slickness doesn’t last too long, but the most important thing is it doesn’t harm the line. Good luck.


ZipCast - World's Finest Fly Line Cleaner, Lubricant And Protectant

 

[onemorecast]

I am a fan of Zipcast too. It's very easy to clean lines with it. Now I just need to discipline myself to do it more often.


Don't know what's in the formula, but it smells strongly of alcohol, like some fishermen I've met.

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Hey everyone, thanks again for all the advice and feedback. After a weekend of fishing I wanted to post an update.

Being that I only had access to Orvis products this past weekend I wasn't able to find any Zipcast. I purchased a "Zip Juice" Wonderline cleaner. I know it's specifically formulated for Orvis Wonderline, but I didn't have many options.

I cleaned the line and it seemed to help in terms of increasing glide and reducing the amount of friction on the guides. What I noticed however was that the tip of the line continued to sink, a problem which got worse as the weekend progressed. I tried to seal the end of the line but it doesn't seem to help. Looks like it's time for a new line. Does anyone have opinions about Wonderline? I figure since I have the cleaner to match it I might as well make the switch...unless of course people think it really sucks or there are significantly better options.

On the plus side, my casting and presentation has improved exponentially. I can now aim my casts and I've been able to get nice curls in the line and I'm starting to place the fly lightly on the water. I'm still no pro, but the improvement was definitely noticeable after some prolonged practice and I don't think the line is really much of a factor. It was mostly going from a tip-flex rod to a mid-flex and learning to slow down my stroke - something I learned from one of the posters to this thread so again, thanks!