Simms turnaround on felt

[Harry]

http://www.anglingtrade.com/2011/06/...-face-on-felt/

By Kirk Deeter

Angling Trade has learned that Simms Fishing Products told its sales representatives, and is now informing dealers, that the company plans to reintroduce boots with felt soles in its 2012 product lineup. You may remember that just a couple years ago, Simms was the company that beat the drum loudest about going felt-free, and swore off production of felt-soled boots after 2010.

As most of you know, felt has been associated with the spread of aquatic invasive species… nasty things like New Zealand mud snails, didymo (rock snot), as well as the parasite that causes whirling disease. In some states, the threats have been taken seriously enough that felt is no longer allowed. You can’t fish in felt in Maryland or Vermont, and starting next year, felt will be banned in Alaska.

The science hasn’t changed, but neither did consumers’ and dealers’ attitudes toward wearing felt—there are still many felt stalwarts who contend there is no adequate substitute for traction in a river. And apparently, a good number of dealers claimed they had plenty of customers who could not be sold on felt alternatives.

As such, Simms director of marketing and brand management Diane Bristol said that the company labored over the decision, but ultimately yielded to the demands of customers, specifically dealers, who said they needed felt in the arsenal.

“It’s ultimately about choices, and allowing customers to make their choices on boots with felt,” said Bristol. “We didn’t take this decision lightly, but ultimately it came down to listening to what our customers wanted.”

Which many will assume means it came down to a matter of money… not just for Simms, but also for dealers.

Simms says it is not disengaging from the invasive species fight by any means. Plans are to reintroduce felt on only three boot models, and the company also intends to amp up efforts to inform consumers about the need to wade clean through additional literature and labeling.

Still, Simms will get plenty of flak for the turnaround, and no doubt expects it. But keep in mind that other major boot makers like Orvis, Patagonia, and Korkers, kept right on chugging with felt production in recent years. So don’t expect any stones thrown from glass houses.

Thus, the Simms turnabout is less of a head fake, and more a situation where Simms tried to lead the market across the avenue, then got caught alone in traffic when the lights changed.

Hopefully, the industry as a whole, takes a harder closer look at the felt issue… not necessarily to regulate, rather to amp up efforts to inform the public about the effects of invasive species.

In truth, aquatic nuisances can be transported in many boot materials, not just felt. In some ways, the notion that an angler got a “free pass” from cleaning boots by buying models with rubber soles was as dangerous as it will be to allow responsible choices and encourage responsible care regarding felt.

Now the choices are more open. It will be interesting to see where consumers, retailers, and manufacturers all go with them.

This entry was posted in Conservation, Industry News, Product News and tagged Angling Trade, didymo, felt wading boot ban, Felt wading boots, Fly fishing, fly fishing business, Invasive Species, Simms fishing products, Whirling Desease. Bookmark the permalink.

 

[Trouser Trout]

The felt sole ban is a whole lot about nothing.

 

[CMoser]

So another words what Simms and everyone else is saying that our water ways are not as important as making money. This is exactly what most other companies say about anything negative they do to the environment. Just keep beating up the earth year after year. If it isnt already, at some point its going to be to late. Leave it for the next generation. Dumb asses!

 

[AKSkim]

"ultimately yielded to the demands of customers, specifically dealers"

... and rightly so.

The substitute soles costs a heck of a lot more, and so far I have heard some very mixed reviews of them.

If they had something that was equal or better than the felt, then there would be no problem with consumers switching to the replace soles.

You never want to be first to buy something new, let other's do the R&D for you.

The second or even third generation generally have all the kinks worked out.

 

[streamfisher]

So another words what Simms and everyone else is saying that our water ways are not as important as making money. This is exactly what most other companies say about anything negative they do to the environment. Just keep beating up the earth year after year. If it isnt already, at some point its going to be to late. Leave it for the next generation. Dumb asses!

I agree with this. Of course companies can do and say what ever they want - It's up to us what we choose to believe. And one thing for sure is that there is no agenda they would carry above making $$$. That's not necessarily a bad thing - mostly bad, though, when it's viewed in short term. Long term, let's see how much fishing related equipment they sell when all the rivers are covered in rock snot.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

I don't see this as Simms selling out, instead it is the combination of not yet having a suitable felt substitute and a lack of public education. When it comes to "banning" things, I prefer to see the individual, taking the initiative through education on a particular issue, to self-ban. I don't like it when the government tells me what to do. I gave up my felts 2 years ago for 2 different rubber soled boots. Both have their pluses and minuses, but neither one is nearly as good gripping the bottom as felt was (I typically used studded felt). So I bought myself a decent wading staff to compensate. Now I can live with myself knowing I'm at least doing something to limit the spread of invasives while educating others on their need to follow suit. But I do miss my felts!

Simms should continue to find a strong alternative to felt while educating the public on the potential problems associated with those soles and then give up felt entirely when we have something as good or better from a grip standpoint.

 

[AKSkim]

I'm at least doing something to limit the spread of invasives while educating others on their need to follow suit.

To really do something about didymo is to go to the major source of the problem.

But NO ONE WANTS TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

To really do something about didymo is to go to the major source of the problem.

But NO ONE WANTS TO DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

Killing every living creature that ventures from stream to stream?

 

[AKSkim]

Killing every living creature that ventures from stream to stream?

No - no nothing like that.

The greatest source of didymo in the northeast is the Delaware River.

All fishing should be banned on that river system for at least 5 years, and then study the findings.



Trust me I am doing my part to prevent the spread of didymo from the Delaware River to other streams.

NYS should call it the AK SKIM PLAN

 

[streamfisher]

I don't 'buy' the story line from SIMMS basically saying the people are forcing them to make felt soles. quote: "ultimately it came down to listening to what our customers wanted.”

That kind of a statement is resentful, nevermind rediculous. So... does this mean to say we don't care about the environement or the ability to actually have fish in the rivers??? So... who are their customers anyway then - in their eyes?

 

[gadfly]

No - no nothing like that.

The greatest source of didymo in the northeast is the Delaware River.

All fishing should be banned on that river system for at least 5 years, and then study the findings.



Trust me I am doing my part to prevent the spread of didymo from the Delaware River to other streams.

NYS should call it the AK SKIM PLAN

I agree with Skim completely. I'll even volunteer to patrol the river by drift boat once a week during good fishing conditions to help with compliance. Anyone want to come?

---------- Post added at 02:20 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:15 PM ----------

I don't see this as Simms selling out, instead it is the combination of not yet having a suitable felt substitute and a lack of public education. When it comes to "banning" things, I prefer to see the individual, taking the initiative through education on a particular issue, to self-ban. I don't like it when the government tells me what to do. I gave up my felts 2 years ago for 2 different rubber soled boots. Both have their pluses and minuses, but neither one is nearly as good gripping the bottom as felt was (I typically used studded felt). So I bought myself a decent wading staff to compensate. Now I can live with myself knowing I'm at least doing something to limit the spread of invasives while educating others on their need to follow suit. But I do miss my felts!

Simms should continue to find a strong alternative to felt while educating the public on the potential problems associated with those soles and then give up felt entirely when we have something as good or better from a grip standpoint.

I agree with Rusty that felt alternatives are lacking in quality right now. I just picked up a pair of those new korkers, and got the big honking studded soles to with them. They are decent, but they're not felt.

Unfortunately, without action from the gov and/or the manufacturers people will still use felt, and some of those people will not bother to clean them properly. Like most invasive species issues, this is a very complicated and difficult problem.

 

[Trouser Trout]

I don't wear felt soles, i also appreciate the point that fisherman don't want to be responsible for introducing didymo or anything else to water where it is not already present, but I think it is an extreme and vivid stretch of the immagination to think that felt soles are responsible for transferring didymo and other aquatic nuisances from stream to stream.

 

[AKSkim]

I think it is an extreme and vivid stretch of the immagination to think that felt soles are responsible for transferring didymo and other aquatic nuisances from stream to stream.

Ducks ass.

Yes that right, it is spread when it clings to a ducks ass.

You ever see a duck when it gets out of the water?

It shakes its ass spreading didymo.

 

[Trouser Trout]

Ducks ass.

Yes that right, it is spread when it clings to a ducks ass.

You ever see a duck when it gets out of the water?

It shakes its ass spreading didymo.

I thought that was just the girl ducks doing it for the boy ducks.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

Didymo is but one of several invasives the industry would like to avoid tracking from stream to stream in felt soles. Whirling disease and zebra mussels are two more. All have been found to flourish for many days depending on conditions, in felt soles, so it's no stretch to think that anglers are spreading some of this just as are the birds and other things that contact infected waters. We can't control the duck's asses, but we can control what we bring to and how we interact with the rivers we all love.


For me, soaking my felt sole boots in bleach solution was impractical.

 

[MACFLY]

I don't 'buy' the story line from SIMMS basically saying the people are forcing them to make felt soles. quote: "ultimately it came down to listening to what our customers wanted.”

That kind of a statement is resentful, nevermind rediculous. So... does this mean to say we don't care about the environement or the ability to actually have fish in the rivers??? So... who are their customers anyway then - in their eyes?

So turn it around..Why would they risk the long term health of their business to make money in the short term. What you forget to realize is that unless all the manufacturers volunteer to do the same thing SIMMS risk losing money and if their customers are saying they still want felt than they are just responding to the market demand. What is ridiculous is to suggest that they are doing this without some demand for the product. If that were true than you would see all of their felt sole products sitting on the shelf. A recent study posted in a fish and wildlife journal suggested the Diddymo may not be the harbinger of death you make it out to be.

The felt alternatives are a dismal failure primarily because the underlying technology works best when the material is heated which is pretty hard to do in a coldwater trout stream. If you as an individual believe felt is a danger than of course you can make a choice to change your behavior. Why wait for the government or the industry to do it? Finally SIMMS has generally been recognized as a company that has sought to educate the public about proper cleaning of equipment. Is this something you do after every trip? If not does that mean you dont care about the fish or the rivers...

 

[Trouser Trout]

Didymo is but one of several invasives the industry would like to avoid tracking from stream to stream in felt soles. Whirling disease and zebra mussels are two more. All have been found to flourish for many days depending on conditions, in felt soles, so it's no stretch to think that anglers are spreading some of this just as are the birds and other things that contact infected waters. We can't control the duck's asses, but we can control what we bring to and how we interact with the rivers we all love.


For me, soaking my felt sole boots in bleach solution was impractical.

Not arguing Rusty, but i'm sure you remember the save the lake 2000 campaign for Lake Hopatcong where the cure all was to stop using certain ferilizers, well it is now 11 years later the lake is the same weedy mess it has always been and the only thing that has been 100000000% proven is lawn fertilizer had nothing to do with the problem, I see the felt sole issue as the same thing although I have no interest in using them.

 

[steve b]

The problem is that instead of a nation wide education program about inspect, dry and clean TU and Smms just jumped into the "sticky" soled shoes. One thing that some forget is that we fly fisherman are a small sub culture of fishing in general, yes the vast majority of us care about the streams we fish and want to do what is right. What I have seen in the shop I guide for is a few fly fisherman come in and buy rubber soled boots add studs and make do. Other "users" of the resource want what is cheapest and dont give a rats ass about the resource and could care less about what they spread. I also blame big box retailers like Cabelas and Bass pro shops as they market their brand name flet sole boots for 1/3 of what a good rubber soled one cost. We are a Korkers dealer and sell tons of those, what we have done it to take the felt sole out of the box replace them with a pair of studded inserts for any one who wants them at no cost. Also the felt inserts are order only, it has helped but I do see what Simms is talking about the average cutomer who only fishes his local stream doesn't want something that really doesn't work well. I personally have two pair of boots one studded felt for all of my local waters and another for travel to places that may be infested with an invasive. I know that felt does add to the spread of invasives, but so do waders, laces on boots, canoes, tubes and a whole list of other things. i think that the industry and conservation organizations need to really put an way more behind education.

Steve

 

[trico mike]

There is no substitue for cleaning and drying all of our gear properly. Rubber soled boots don't give us a pass. I bought a pair a few years ago and still clean them the same as if they were felt, and no they do not offer the same traction. I wonder how many guys take the time to clean their boats properly. My buddy saw a few drift boats on the little j this year and is really worried about rock snot. How many boat owners have a hot powerwasher to clean them with. Even if the boat is cleaned right the run off will most likley get into a storm drain wich may in turn end up in another river. As others have said wildlife can spread it to other river systems as well as floods. We are all foolish to think that a felt sole ban can really work. More studies need to be done to figure out why rock snot prefers certain enviroments over others. Remember to clean your gear or have a second set to use. It only takes one knucklehead to spread this stuff and sad to say I see many of them nowandays.

 

[Trouser Trout]

There is no substitue for cleaning and drying all of our gear properly. Rubber soled boots don't give us a pass. I bought a pair a few years ago and still clean them the same as if they were felt, and no they do not offer the same traction. I wonder how many guys take the time to clean their boats properly. My buddy saw a few drift boats on the little j this year and is really worried about rock snot. How many boat owners have a hot powerwasher to clean them with. Even if the boat is cleaned right the run off will most likley get into a storm drain wich may in turn end up in another river. As others have said wildlife can spread it to other river systems as well as floods. We are all foolish to think that a felt sole ban can really work. More studies need to be done to figure out why rock snot prefers certain enviroments over others. Remember to clean your gear or have a second set to use. It only takes one knucklehead to spread this stuff and sad to say I see many of them nowandays.

What you say is simple common sense, which isn't so common.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

Not arguing Rusty, but i'm sure you remember the save the lake 2000 campaign for Lake Hopatcong where the cure all was to stop using certain ferilizers, well it is now 11 years later the lake is the same weedy mess it has always been and the only thing that has been 100000000% proven is lawn fertilizer had nothing to do with the problem, I see the felt sole issue as the same thing although I have no interest in using them.

You'd be 100% wrong on the Save the Lake Campaign to significantly reduce phosphorous into the Lake. It has had its desired effect in steadily improving water quality since the campaign began. DEP water quality testing has show steady improvement year to year, mostly due to the significant reduction by landowners of high phosphorous fertilizers in the lake's watershed. The last big issue at the Lake (they are also targeting old stormwater runoff systems and replacing the worst ones then focusing on the second tier, etc.) is the continued use of septic systems in half of Hopatcong Twp. and in the Jefferson Twp. sections. Unless and until those two towns go to sewers the lake will only get so much better in water quality. As for weed growth, there are many more factors than just phosphorous. But that's another topic for another day...

We are all foolish to think that a felt sole ban can really work. More studies need to be done to figure out why rock snot prefers certain enviroments over others.

Nobody has ever said that removing all felt will stop all spread of Didymo. But it is obvious that it can help and hence we should do what we can to limit its spread. But once again, Didymo is only one of many invasives easily spread by felt soles. Get whirling disease in the upper D and watch as those beautiful rainbows die off en mass and you'll all wish you did more to prevent its spread.

 

[Trouser Trout]

You'd be 100% wrong on the Save the Lake Campaign to significantly reduce phosphorous into the Lake. It has had its desired effect in steadily improving water quality since the campaign began. DEP water quality testing has show steady improvement year to year, mostly due to the significant reduction by landowners of high phosphorous fertilizers in the lake's watershed. The last big issue at the Lake (they are also targeting old stormwater runoff systems and replacing the worst ones then focusing on the second tier, etc.) is the continued use of septic systems in half of Hopatcong Twp. and in the Jefferson Twp. sections. Unless and until those two towns go to sewers the lake will only get so much better in water quality. As for weed growth, there are many more factors than just phosphorous. But that's another topic for another day...



Nobody has ever said that removing all felt will stop all spread of Didymo. But it is obvious that it can help and hence we should do what we can to limit its spread. But once again, Didymo is only one of many invasives easily spread by felt soles. Get whirling disease in the upper D and watch as those beautiful rainbows die off en mass and you'll all wish you did more to prevent its spread.

On no Rusty i would be 100% correct in stating that the weed mess in lake Hopatcong is worse than ever and the save the lake 2000 campaign which was all about reducing fertilizer usage with phosphorus has accomplished nothing to control the weeds. nothing....... zero....zilch.... the weeds are as bad this year as they have ever been......

 

[pitbull]

I don't 'buy' the story line from SIMMS basically saying the people are forcing them to make felt soles. quote: "ultimately it came down to listening to what our customers wanted.”

That kind of a statement is resentful, nevermind rediculous. So... does this mean to say we don't care about the environement or the ability to actually have fish in the rivers??? So... who are their customers anyway then - in their eyes?

there customers are the ones who like felt!