Handling Line

[mudbug201]

The nymph rod thread got me thinking about a question I've had for a while.

Do you guys have any tricks for handling line when making long casts and retrieves?

Forget short line situations when you can just let your spare line gather at your feet or in the water, or wherever, and forget stripping baskets. What about the in between situations? You make a 60 foot cast and then mend a bunch more line onto the water and now you have to bring it all back in to make another 60 footer.

I've been spooling line loosely in my left hand for years, then unspooling it with a couple of false casts to get the line back out during the cast. You can even shoot line off right off your hand if you do it right. Works great until it doesn't. But when it doesn't work it sucks, and a birds nest of triangle taper goes smack into my bottom guide and everything goes to shit forever immediately. Would like to improve my game in this area. Any tactics I should know about?

 

[FIN-ITE 34]

Just be sure to take notes when you get some answers.

I sometimes find it less troublesome to use large loops like you would use for a Spey or Skagit cast when bringing in line. For me it has less chance of tangling or coiling great lengths of line.

 

[Simms]

I tend to use this approach when in "line management" mode:

I also play cats cradle.

 

[sneelhead]

i wear a stripping basket when i fish the gorge with my nymph rod

 

[sunsignarcher]

You can leave it all dangle downstream like I do and watch all the shmeg floating by accumulate in the fold

 

[Simms]

But first id suggest downloading this app:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=gse.ayai&hl=en

You'll know right away of what direction you need to head in after you view your results.

 

[FIN-ITE 34]

But first id suggest downloading this app:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=gse.ayai&hl=en

You'll know right away of what direction you need to head in after you view your results.

I can't figure out how to play the game. Guess I don't need to know the results.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

Line floats, so let it do just that between casts. Looping it over your left hand is a recipe for disaster as it sounds like you have figured out. Make the 60' cast, toss in your mend, follow the fly past the fish, lift it off the water and load the rod with a single backcast, and fire off another cast. There shouldn't be much line in the water and what line there is will sail right where you want it to go.

Too many folks grew up FFing after watching the shadow casting scenes from A River Runs Through It. You can't catch a fish ever if your line is always in the air. Learn to properly and deeply load a rod on a single backcast and shoot it forward and problem solved. The best anglers on big rivers like the upper D can all do this blindfolded.

 

[mudbug201]

Line floats, so let it do just that between casts. Looping it over your left hand is a recipe for disaster as it sounds like you have figured out. Make the 60' cast, toss in your mend, follow the fly past the fish, lift it off the water and load the rod with a single backcast, and fire off another cast. There shouldn't be much line in the water and what line there is will sail right where you want it to go. Too many folks grew up FFing after watching the shadow casting scenes from A River Runs Through It. You can't catch a fish ever if your line is always in the air. Learn to properly and deeply load a rod on a single backcast and shoot it forward and problem solved. The best anglers on big rivers like the upper D can all do this blindfolded.

nah it's a pretty basic skill that "the best anglers" use all the time to fish streamers with no basket or to keep large amounts of line from bellying downstream. They just do it well whereas I do it shittily.

Anyway thanks for nothing boobs

 

[WBDluver]

No Rusty is right. The line on the water will load the rod. You can use the surface tension to assist in that. Just try it. Start to pick up with you rod tip parallel to the water with no slack. Single strip and snap back. The rod will load and then complete your forward cast.

 

[Rusty Spinner]

No Rusty is right. The line on the water will load the rod. You can use the surface tension to assist in that. Just try it. Start to pick up with you rod tip parallel to the water with no slack. Single strip and snap back. The rod will load and then complete your forward cast.

Bingo. No matter how often I teach my clients to water load, the very next cast they gently lift their line off and begin a series of false casts. STOP IT!

Learn by lifting off the water with a single back cast and then firing it forward to your target. Shoot line if needed. Stop all that ridiculous false casting unless by false casting you are timing a steadily rising fish. That is the only time I false cast. Lift, fire, mend, hookset, fight, land, release, and repeat. Everything else is a waste of your time on the water. mudbug, find me on the water one day and I'll be happy to help you. If you are a quick learner, you'll get it right away.

 

[mudbug201]

Bingo. No matter how often I teach my clients to water load, the very next cast they gently lift their line off and begin a series of false casts. STOP IT!

Learn by lifting off the water with a single back cast and then firing it forward to your target. Shoot line if needed. Stop all that ridiculous false casting unless by false casting you are timing a steadily rising fish. That is the only time I false cast. Lift, fire, mend, hookset, fight, land, release, and repeat. Everything else is a waste of your time on the water. mudbug, find me on the water one day and I'll be happy to help you. If you are a quick learner, you'll get it right away.

I think you guys fixated on the false cast thing (one at most, and typically perpendicular to the lie) and are now intent on giving a patronizing lecture about surface tension and so forth.

I agree with everything you're saying. It's basic but I appreciate it anyway. Yes there are lots of knuckleheads who whip the water into a froth with unnecessary false casting because they saw Brad Pitt do it. I imagine 90% of your time guiding Rusty is spent correcting the idea that fly fishing is unfurling one tight loop after another over a stream for no reason and spooking every trout in sight. Not only will you not catch many fish if you do that on the Upper EB in gin clear and sunny conditions.. you won't catch any. I'm definitely not a pro, but I do alright.

The question is, during your retrieve, what you do with the line. This is an issue especially but not exclusively when fishing streamers, which I do a lot of. If you strip sixty feet of line onto moving water, and then reload and shoot, you'll be shooting line that has bellied down into the current and won't come off the water. That's the problem.

And here's a solution. And here. No thanks to the NEFF brain trust.

(it must have been a dumb question - if Simms is calling you an idiot you know you're in trouble)

 

[Matt Grobert]

Edit: I wrote this while mudbug was posting.....so it applies to the posts before his post.

I don't agree, and I think in the end it is up to each angler how they manage their line. I most often coil extra line in my left hand between my thumb and fingers when I fish - the coils are about 6-8 inches in diameter and they easily release from my fingers one at a time or two at a time depending on how I release the line. When I begin to cast, I release the line as I extend my cast out to my target. It's like anything else we do, it takes some practice. I don't want my line dangling in the water, especially if it's fast because I want to know where it is at all times and have control over it as I work my cast and my drift. I sometimes use water tension, but more often I keep the line coiled in my left hand.

The right way, is the way that works for you as an individual. One size does not necessarily fit all.

Matt

 

[Rusty Spinner]

I think you guys fixated on the false cast thing (one at most, and typically perpendicular to the lie) and are now intent on giving a patronizing lecture about surface tension and so forth.

I agree with everything you're saying. It's basic but I appreciate it anyway. Yes there are lots of knuckleheads who whip the water into a froth with unnecessary false casting because they saw Brad Pitt do it. I imagine 90% of your time guiding Rusty is spent correcting the idea that fly fishing is unfurling one tight loop after another over a stream for no reason and spooking every trout in sight. Not only will you not catch many fish if you do that on the Upper EB in gin clear and sunny conditions.. you won't catch any. I'm definitely not a pro, but I do alright.

The question is, during your retrieve, what you do with the line. This is an issue especially but not exclusively when fishing streamers, which I do a lot of. If you strip sixty feet of line onto moving water, and then reload and shoot, you'll be shooting line that has bellied down into the current and won't come off the water. That's the problem.

And here's a solution. And here. No thanks to the NEFF brain trust.

(it must have been a dumb question - if Simms is calling you an idiot you know you're in trouble)

I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit. :crap: As I clearly stated, line floats, so let it. It's not going anywhere. Let it drift downstream and when you lift for your backcast, it will come off the water when you let some slide through your left hand (assuming you are right handed) or just shoot your line and the line on the water will follow it. The only time I use a stripping basket is in the saltwater from the beach because the outgoing waves will pull it under and create too much tension to avoid needing a bunch of false casts. But in a river, it's more or less a few feet away. Sorry for being basic, but the basics never fail........

 

[lightenup]

I play cat's cradle with my left hand, all the while shooting line 60 feet, landing my fly 18 inches in front of the rising slob, sipping a cup of tea, and translating War and Peace to archaic Sumerian......


We don't have these problems in New Jersey........but I would agree with Grobert, to each his own...I would also think that 60 feet of line floating in a loop downstream in a current, would break the surface tension and sometimes sink a bit, at least that has been my experience with much less line on the water.......When I retrieve, I tend to loop the line in my left hand...Sometimes, before I cast I will give the rod a flick forwards, placing much of the retrieved line in front of my on the water, where it is most certainly floating, then use the water tension the snap the line and make one, sometimes two false casts to get the line to go somewhere, usually not where I thought it would go, but it goes somewhere...This keeps the line close to me, so as not to disturb the water I am drifting in when it is snapped off the water..........

 

[Simms]

If you're making false casts (while do anything other than dry fly fishing) you suck. Learn to single spey cast and you'll never be that fucktard on the stream false casting an indie or streamer set up.

 

[tomfly]

I agree with LU. The less line you have to contend with the better control you have of the drift. I would rather find a way to get into a location that is in a better position to shorten the distance between myself and the fish. I find it more conducive to get a good presentation if there is not 4 or 5 currents that my line has to cross. If there are eddies to contend with, that makes it that much more difficult. It is a rare event if I have more then 20 feet of line out. I don't fish streamers that often, I would rather swing a wet fly. When I do mend a line I just let it loop in front of my. I never had a problem with shooting it out.