Complex HATCHES!

[Broadheadscreek]

Being in an area with a diverse aquatic insect population we often encounter complex hatches and spinner falls at these times the trout go nuts and so do the fly fishermen ( explains the hair loss and grayhair as well as talking to ones self). When they occur it is a very tricky time as some fish key in on caddis while others are on sulfers and still others on slate drakes and spinners of every discription. It can be a great time on the water if you are prepaired if not very frustating. I like to throw spinner patterns in these situations and seem to have luck doing so. I carry a good variaty of sizes from size 10-20 in rusty,sulfer,cahill and other colors and change as needed till I start getting takes. Do any of you here encounter these conditions often? And what tactics and flies do you prefer to use?

 

[BIGBOW]

I think that people can drive themselves nuts matching the hatch. The longer I've been fishing, the more comfortable I've become (and the more luck I've had) throwing out an attractor like a wulff or an adams in a situation with various hatches occurring. I keep dozens of each particular fly in my boxes, but my go-to flies always seem to be the same. Unless of course there's just one or two hatches going on (bwo or midges for example).

 

[Agust]

Two schools of thought, and I alternate between them depending on how I feel on the spur of the moment.

First, hatch breaking. Put on a Streamer, Ant, beetle, a hopper or a big ass attractor that will sometimes elicit a strike from the voraciously feeding fish. This sometimes works, sometimes is just a useless as trying to match one of the many hatches going on.

Second. hard core matching to the specific fish. Use a pair of binoculars and zoom in on the specific fish, try and see the bug that the fish is taking. Very often each fish is on a different bug. So while the rusty spinner works for the brown in the tailout, the rainbow in the head may be on the caddis emergers.

Both methods have been know to work, and both have been known to be utter failures. In that case: Sometimes, going back to the car and taking sip of good scotch from the flask helps. Well at least it doesn't hurt.

 

[GARYB]

What drives you nuts is how you wait all afternoon and then in the last 1/2 hour of
light the trout go crazy and you can't figure out what they are taking. Yeah I know
they most likely are taking emergers, but it can be really hard to figure out. If I don't see
what they are eating, around now I will try a sulphur, bwo cdc emerger or tan caddis emerger. Then I may try some spinners even if I don't see any. Sometimes the above tactics work sometimes they don't. I wish I could nail down the answer better but I guess
that's fishing.

 

[Broadheadscreek]

Thank you for your participation in this thread it is going to be interesting to read some different views on this subject. And how many of you handle this situation.

 

[Dizzy]

Spinner pattern is usually my first choice as well… if multiple fish are working I can usually get a few of them to take the spinner pattern. And a lot of times it seems like the biggest fish will be working spinners (easy meal).

I hit this scenario up at Resica Falls first week of June. Got there are 6pm, several species of caddis dancing over the water, a mixed bag of small stoneflies present, occasional Stenocron’s popping off, and quite a mish-mosh of adults (spinners) present over the riffles. Fish were working real good and I opted for a #12 Rusty Spinner (coin toss versus a Ginger Quill) and the fish responded. About an hour later I got the “WHAT ARE YOU USING?” from my buddy just upstream… told him “SPINNER” and he switched up and took 3 on the same pattern (he was using different caddis imitations before that). At dusk the “Chalk Cahills” started coming off in decent numbers and the fish switched over to duns until after it was too dark to see anymore.

 

[Corndog]

5 star thread huh.

I always try to match the hatch first...mainly because that's the fishing technique I enjoy the most. If the fish are rising close enough that I can see what they area taking on the surface that usually works. But, you have to have the patience to just stand there and watch bugs floating by to determine what they are taking. If I cannot determine what they are taking and have tried every fly in the air and floating by in the water, I then go to a black or cream midge and usually (notice I said usually cause this doesn't always work and I start pulling my hair out) catch fish.

Now on big water like the BK or D, many times the rising fish are so far away that you cannot detect what they are feeding on. In that situation, I usually stick with what's hatching and just keep presenting it to them hoping in a moment of weekness they will take my fly.

When there are fish rising I never resort to fishing subsurface to try to pick up a fish. Personal choice...not a purist or anything like that. I have no problem with you guys who go to a nymph, emerger, streamer, etc. Dry fly fishing is just my favorite way to take a trout.

Good thread BHC,
Cdog

 

[JeffK]

Once again, Agust said it best. Go novel or go hard core match-the-hatch. When tricos are tough an ant or inch worm often does the trick.

Fish eating on the surface can usually be fooled sooner or later. The question is generally just fly pattern, since dead drift is almost always the presentation needed and you can see the fly in relation to the fish and correct mistakes. I like sparkle duns and parachute flies, but never forget the spinners.

The ones that drive me nuts are the fish eating just below the surface. Then it has to both look right and act right! Getting it to move right considering you can't see it is a challenge for me. That is a bear, as my last trip to the brodhead with BHC and Biot proved. When the fish were chasing something (I'd guess caddis pupa) subsurface I got one nibble and no hook ups. Once the fish were on the surface they weren't pushovers, but a big slate drake spinner fooled a few.

 

[Pete]

Nothing as complex as the original post...but:

I've had occasional success fishing two hatches, with one fly on the tippet, and one on a dropper. Some fish take one fly...some take the other. On one occaion, a greedy little brown took both.

Disclaimer: Most of the fish I see these days are dumb stockies.

 

[Broadheadscreek]

Nothing as complex as the original post...but:

I've had occasional success fishing two hatches, with one fly on the tippet, and one on a dropper. Some fish take one fly...some take the other. On one occaion, a greedy little brown took both.

Disclaimer: Most of the fish I see these days are dumb stockies.

That was a hungry trout Pete! I have tried this method as well but with three flies dry trailed by a spinner and an emerger off the spinner you can cover the stages this way but tough casting. If you do try this use 5x to reduce the likelihood of tangles.

 

[theartoflee]

First let me state that I am never perpared which always works against me in most situations. However in difficult situations these are the flys I like to fish.

Pseudos if they are around in size 22 emerger as a lot of times there around but hard to identify on the water.

If both caddis and mayflys are around which is often a usual can be effective as it represents both caddis and mayflys.

If they are feeding sub to surface I break out the skunk saver a parachute pheasant tail in the size of the predominant mayfly.

Or a spinner with a shuck..

If you want to cheat a size 20 phesant tail flash back as a dropper almost always works.

 

[bkill]

My first step is to try and match the hatch as close as possible..That being said, those that fish with me know that I believe it is 90% presentation..

I agree with others, a rusty spinner will usually take a selective trout...But I use an ISO Parachute to imitate the spinners this time of year...

When I get that really difficult fish, and just before I give up on him...I throw him an FU Fly...Which is usually something big...It works more often than you would think....

 

[eddavidson9]

First let me state that I am never perpared which always works against me in most situations.

that about describes me as well.

if i can see the flies and got something that's close, it goes on. if not, i'll just cycle through whatever i feel like. if i stumble on success, i make a note of the conditions and try to remember it for next time.

 

[Bamboozle]

Ahhhh, complex hatches...

...another way to say WTF!!!

Or an excuse for getting skunked!

When the hatch is compound, such as when different trout are taking different life stages of the same insect; I prefer Bourbon.

When the hatch is complex, such as when different trout are taking different insects; I prefer Scotch.

When the hatch is compound and complex, such as when different trout are taking different life stages of the same insects and other more aggravating trout are taking different insects just to piss me off; I prefer to throw rocks at them or watch old Flintstones cartoons at home.

When I have no Bourbon or Scotch, rocks are scarce and the only cartoon on TV is Sponge Bob; I will try and match what I THINK the fish are on, based on what I see and the rise form. This is usually a trial and error process with emphasis on the error.

The fun part is all of the revelations I have in the process when I know I have it figured out, only to be humbled by a 10" rainbow laughing its ass off at what I thought would work. Other tricks I have up my sleeve are something larger, something smaller, a totally wacky choice like a Woolly Bugger or the "right" fly on a lighter tippet.

What usually happens is I forget all of that crap and I remind myself that I am the superior intellect in the battle. I am at the top of the food chain for a reason and could eat that SOB trout...

...if I could only catch it!

After I convince myself, I make constant adjustments to my presentation with whatever fly I am using while trying to eliminate drag as much as possible by casting in different directions, changing position, tweaking my leader or targeting fish in downstream lies.

If that doesn't work, I'll fish until dark in the hopes that the moron fish will will come out to play when their eyesight and mine is impaired.

Sometimes that works better than anything, including Bourbon!

 

[NJpatbee]

If it is obvious what fly the trout are taking, then I match the hatch, otherwise my thought pattern goes something like the following:

1. Splashy rises and Mayflies and Caddis Hatching?
Then go with a fluttering caddis pattern - occasional twitch
No Luck?
Try a Caddis Pupa/Emerger Pattern

2. Sipping rises and Mayflies and Caddis Hatching?
Go with the Mayfly.
Multiple sized Mayflies?
Go with the Smaller size.
Near Dusk?
Use a Spinner versus Dun

3. Repeat Steps 1 & 2 until all fish are caught or patterns are exhausted.
Trout still feeding at or near the surface?
Put on a Partridge & Orange Soft-Hackle & catch all remaining trout

 

[Burtbords149]

NJPB,

I like your matching logic there, seems to make sense. Now about that Partridge and orange I hear so much about....how do you like to fish it, dead drift like a dry?....swing it downstream?

 

[NJpatbee]

I fish the soft-hackle across and downstream, mending to avoid drag, and then let it swing at the end of the drift. I typically retrieve the fly upstream in short 2-3 inch strips for a few yards after it swings acroos the stream. For the record, I prefer a thorax of brown fur on the Partridge/Orange soft hackle wet fly (I like to think that the trout prefer it also). This fly (and other soft-hackles) with the above and similar techniques has balied me out numerous times.

There are several books on the soft-hackle by Sylvester Nemes, and the technique of Jim Liesenring (Liesenring Lift) is covered in his book "The Art of Tying the Wet Fly and Fishing the Flymph".
A short description of the technique is described on the linke below:

Frontrangeanglers.com - The Leisenring Lift