presentation help

[frogge]

Hey,
I'm trying to become a more elegant fly fisher. I've observed several people with alot more skill than me picking there line up and laying it down immediately with no fuss and a straight leader. I'm using a 5wt rod with wt forward line. I have a 7.5ft. 4x leader with additional 4x and 5x tippet to about total nine ft. I'm finding it difficult to cast intermediate to short distances with small flys(20's). Leader lands in a heap. On longer casts with size 14 parachutes the fly foats out of the sky nicely and comes to rest on the water like a bug. I'm suspecting this is mainly lack of technique on my part, but also wonder if overlining the rod would help with shorter casts and if I should try a shorter leader. Thanks, Frogge.

 

[CR]

Sounds like you would greatly benefit by hiring a guide or taking a few lessons from a pro. It's like anything else...you can screw around on your own for years and gradually improve, or you can hire a pro and learning the thing much quicker. Ever take a golf lesson, for instance? Your swing improves greatly in just one day.

It's all about your level of commitment.

 

[frogge]

Hey,
Excellent advice. I'm a died in the wool do it yourselfer. I enjoy figuring things out and often suffer a long learning curve. Can't stand golf, but did teach myself whitewater kayaking and backcountry skiing. I know that good instruction is very helpfull though and Maybe I'll come around. I grew up on skates and took my first skating lesson when I was about 35. Not only did I learn alot fast, but I learned how to teach skating better. I was hoping the trout would teach me. Thanks,Grasshopper.

 

[JAR1]

CR is right. Get a pro to show you and then practice. You do not need to be in water to practice casting. If you have a yard or a park near by you need to practice, practice, practice. Then when you are on the water you will be suprised how improved your line control becomes. Improved line control equals more fish.

Many years ago I went to a 2 day clinic w/ Joe Humphries. At this point I had already read his books and many, many more and I would have rated my self a Knowlegable, but not a very effective fly fisherman. After the clinic I made sure I hit the stream on a very regular basis. In a short amount of time my catch rate went up to numbers I wouldn't have thought realistic. It has been fun!

2 years ago I went to see Gary Borger at the Little Lehigh Fly shop. I made a comment during a break to Gary that even after 15 years of fly casting my Double Haul was not very good. In 2 minutes he had me throwing out more line than I ever have. Since then I use a single or double haul constantly. It took 2 minutes!! (I made a point to practice daily for 2 weeks after the lesson to teach my muscle memory)

Nothing beats proper instruction followed by stream time.

 

[Corndog]

Frogge,
Their right about getting an good cast down. You gotta learn from the pros. If you dont' want to take lessons, then get a casting video and watch and learn.

JAR1,
Hello. Nice to meet a fellow Joe Humphries school of fly fishing alumni.
I was sad to see him retired. He has been my mentor for many years.

Cdog

 

[AKSkim]

I'm finding it difficult to cast intermediate to short distances with small flys(20's). Leader lands in a heap. Frogge.

There have been many times I wish I could have made a "puddle cast".

Enough of that.

Sounds to me without seeing the cast... your simply not loading the rod.

A few gentleman have already spoken of Mr. Humphries and he has a "Tap - Tap" technique in casting. You generally have to accelerate your hand more (faster) to load the rod tip. Stop. Accelerate forward. Stop. 11:00 - 12:00, swing a hammer.. up, stop, down. 11:00 - 12:00. "Tap-Tap."

He used my son to demonstrate his casting techniques at a show a few years ago. A right handed caster, kneeling down on his left knee, right elbow on the right knee and make a cast from that position. That should help you practice your hand acceleration and cast a much tighter loop.

Also, consider purchasing a Royal Wulff "Fly-O" to practice with. Sounds funny, but it really helps you develop a nice cast.

When I was taking spey casting lessons, I was having trouble with developing the same acceleration on the back cast as the forward cast on a single spey cast. I used the Fly-O to develop that hand movement.

Besides, it is also a very useful and safe way to aggravate someone in the same room.... Just remember after you accidently hit that certain someone.. while your running bring the Fly-O with you, other wise she may accidently break it on you (another $30.00 lesson learned with a Fly-O).

As always, learning the hard way.

AK Skim

 

[Corndog]

Hey AK,
If that was at the NJ Flyfishing Show, My son and I were probably standing next to you. After the demo, he took my son aside and gave him some pointers. What a great guy huh. He loves to teach the kids.
Cdog

 

[AKSkim]

After the demo, he took my son aside and gave him some pointers. What a great guy huh. He loves to teach the kids.
Cdog

He is truly a class act....

 

[Big_Spinner]

Hi,

I like this analogy when trying to describe the casting stroke.

If you have a knife in your hand with a potato stuck on the end of the knife, you want to flick the knife so the potato comes off and travels parallel to the ground. The stroke is similar both forward and back.

This seems to get people to:

use the right amount of power when casting

stop the rod tip high

use the proper amount of arm in motion and using some but limited wrist action at the end of the cast.

Jim

 

[NJFred]

While part of it is likely casting skills, some of your problem maybe with the construction of your leader. It appears to turn over with larger flys but not smaller ones if I'm not mistaken. Can you get the leader to straigthen out properly (turn over as some would say) at close distence with a large bug on the end of it? If so then you might try a different leader.

Leaders can perform poorly if they get "out of balance" with repeated use and fly changes. One of the things I do is tie my own leaders in the proper proportions of segments. I also tie half leaders so that I can simply clip off a poor performing leader in the middle and tie on a well propotioned bottom half while on the river (this is important as I use a crazy glue splice to attach the leader to the fly line. I don't change the top half of the leader all season long)

I would work the kinks out of your casting stroke and your leader first prior to overlinning your rod. Good suggestions on casting from all.

Good luck.

 

[beeber]

Hi,

I like this analogy when trying to describe the casting stroke.

If you have a knife in your hand with a potato stuck on the end of the knife, you want to flick the knife so the potato comes off and travels parallel to the ground. The stroke is similar both forward and back.

This seems to get people to:

use the right amount of power when casting

stop the rod tip high

use the proper amount of arm in motion and using some but limited wrist action at the end of the cast.

Jim

Sounds to me like you're not coming to an abrupt stop on the forward cast, maybe back cast too. Stand at a 45 degree angle to where you are casting and watch your loop. I like the knife analogy, but I also like the one with the paintbrush where you are trying to flick the paint off the brush. Same idea.

Bill

 

[frogge]

Hey,
thanks for all the help. I sent away today for an Echo Micro Practice fly rod. This is similar to the Fly-O. It comes with a book by Mcnair. I know that I'm still in the do it yourself mode, but I'm under time and geographic constraints. One thing I'm lacking is a cat to cast to. I'll try the dog. I tied all my leaders when I was younger. Now I just tie on tippet to a tapered leader. May go back to rolling my own. Despite my incompetent presentation and casting technique, my fly tieing has allowed me to catch a few fish. I read somewhere that you should not practice casting when you are fishing. Last night I went to the local lake and started practicing at the boat launch. I was still having trouble getting the leader to straighten out. As I was figuring this out fish started taking the fly messing up the whole exercise. Go figure! thanks again, Frogge.

 

[Corndog]

Don't ya just hate it when the fish get in the way. LOL

 

[Bill Sell]

I use a furled leader.
They turn over easy even if your casting is les than perfect.
A plus is you only replace tippet, not leaders.

 

[Green Highlander]

Hi Frogge,

What is the brand name and model of your fly rod? The reason I ask is because you say you throw a good loop on far casts but not on short casts. Perhaps the rod is too fast for short casts. The reason I say that is because my 5wt. T&T Horizon doesn't cast well unless I throw it a minimum of about 35-40 feet. If you cast well with a longer line, I question whether it's your stroke, it could be the rod. Additionally, if you are using a tapered 4x leader, just tie a few feet of 5x and don't add more 4x because that will cause your leader to "flop".

GH

 

[frogge]

Hey GH,
I'm embarrased to admit that my rod is a White River, from Bass Pro Shops. That said in this land of Orvis and Winston. I did build an Orvis rod when I was a kid("friend" "borrowed " it and failed to return it). I think it is an overstatement to say my longer casts are good. The loops are somewhat better. You have a good point and I do think I messed up my leader. I promised myself I wouldn't get sucked into making a relaxing hobbie into another source of frustration. I'm pretty certain that my technique pretty much sucks and my next step is to do some practicing to try to iron things out. After a year or too of false starts I'll probably get some instruction. But what can I say, I've got polish blood in my veins. Thanks for the suggestion, Frogge.

 

[AKSkim]

embarrased to admit that my rod is a White River, from Bass Pro Shops.

You already know, but don't be. You have a rod that you like and the name on the side... well in all honesty.. doesn't matter.

To prove that point.. go ahead and read the thread that is floating around now on the outstanding brand name waders.. SIMMS...

Practice your casts!

As always, its inside that counts.

Fr. AK Skim