Help with herl

[baccala]

I have recently got back into fly tying after about 25 years and I didn't do much trying back then. I have been trying to tie up some Zug Bugs and Prince Nymphs, but I just can not seem to get the herl bodies right. They come out skinny. I have tried to spin 3 or so strands into herl rope like some books have suggested but I seem to get more quill then fluff showing. Is this because I am using old material or am I doing something wrong.
Thanks
Tim

 

[Broadheadscreek]

If you have good peacock herl 2-3 strands should be fine for the work you are doing when tying it in start with the but end of the herl tied in first this will give you more herl showing when your fly is complete. Hope this helps you out.

 

[baccala]

Should I twist the herl into a rope or just wrap all three up the hook shank?

 

[Bamboozle]

Look for herl with a long flue fibers. I buy packages of strung herl for my Peacock bodied flies and save the herl from the eyes to annoy cats.

I use three strands for flies like size 14-10 and two or one for smaller flies. After selecting three strands I cut off the tips so I am at the fuzzy part of the herl and all strands are kind of even.

After tying in the herl by the cut tips I incorporate a length of tying thread into the mix by making a loop of thread where I tie in the herl. You can leave the thread as a loop or cut one end so you have only one strand; it really doesn't matter.

I then grab all three strands of herl & the thread in an EZ-Hook or a pair of hackle pliers and twist it into a herl chenille. The thread will keep the herl from breaking and unwinding even if one strand breaks in the twisting or wrapping process.

The result is a bullet proof and fuzzy fly.

At least when I do it.

 

[afishinado]

Exactly! - ditto what Bamboozle said. It works every time and makes the fly very durable. The same method works well Pheasant tail fibers when tying the body of a PT. Also try a little wax on the thread which helps hold it together. Good luck.

 

[frogge]

Hey,
I know this is heretical, but I often substitute peacock ice dubbing for peacock herl. I like the flash, and can control the profile. Toodles,Frogge.

 

[Bamboozle]

frogge:

You may do this already but if you haven't; try Peacock or Peacock Black Ice Dub in a dubbing loop. The results are extraordinary!

BTW - tacky wax helps A LOT!

 

[JeffK]

Vary the number of peacock herls for the size of the fly or nymph. 2 or 3 is fine for average sized flies, but you may need up to 6 for a stonefly sized nymph. In addition, sometimes a tapered underbody of wrapped thread, yarn, or weight is needed to get the right shape for a larger nymph. Watch out though, you don't need much of an underbody with peaock herl.

 

[MR.MCR]

It drives me nuts when your almost done and the herl breaks........

 

[Agust]

If you want to avoid the herl breaking, make sure it is not dried out. If you are getting lots of "breakage" you can either soak it in water or spread it on a screen and steam it. You will need to wait a while to work with it, but it should stop them from breaking.

I usually spin 2-3 peacock herl around the thread for zug bugs. For royal coachman I like to use select individual fibers and spin them like hackle. Not as durable but makes a pretty fly. You can make the fly more durable by laying a thread base on the hook shank, then apply some head cement to the thread (not fast drying head cement) and wrap the herl over the thread, being careful to lay each wrap tight against but not over the previous one.

Biots also tend to get brittle and break, for them I always peel the individual biots from the feather and place in a folded over wet paper towel. I guess that could work for peacock too, but I haven't tried it.

 

[AKSkim]

If you want to avoid the herl breaking, make sure it is not dried out. If you are getting lots of "breakage" you can either soak it in water or spread it on a screen and steam it. You will need to wait a while to work with it, but it should stop them from breaking.

Nice tip.. I'll have to try that next time.

 

[NJpatbee]

frogge:

You may do this already but if you haven't; try Peacock or Peacock Black Ice Dub in a dubbing loop. The results are extraordinary!

BTW - tacky wax helps A LOT!

Although I am a traditionalist at heart, for wet flies and nymphs the Ice Dub cannot be beat. I soothe my conscience by tying up a half dozen Quill Gordon dries using the ingedients called for by the master, and have my own challenges with peacock herl!

 

[baccala]

Thank you everyone. All have been good tips. But any ideas why I get such anorexic bodies.

 

[khuhner]

Thank you everyone. All have been good tips. But any ideas why I get such anorexic bodies.

Add more herl? It's really a factor of how big a fly you are tying, how thick your herl is and how many strands you use.

Kurt

 

[JeffK]

And don't forget the underbodies. Randall Kaufmann's book on tying nymphing has great info on building up an underbody before you add the herl to get a fuller body on a large fly.

 

[afishinado]

Adding a few more herl fibers can beef up the fly body a little bit, but for larger flies you can build it up with thread, or wrap some lead on the shank, or use yarn or dubbing as an underbody for the herl. I weight most of my nymphs, and usually use .010 - .030 lead wire as an underbody, depending on the size of the fly.

 

[Mayfly]

If you purchased 'herl' strung or in the packages, chances are you've gotten lousy stuff. The best herl is the stuff extending about a foot below the peacock tail feather eye. It will cost a little more but it's well worth it. Stronger quills. More lustrous color. Longer fibers. Easier to work with, etc. The quality of the herl you're using is possibly/probably the reason for the "anemic" bodies and problems you've described.


Allan

 

[Burtbords149]

On the average peacock herl strand, near the center all the fibers are about the same length. Even if you put 10 strand you will get a fuller look but not a thicker body diameter. To get the preferred tapered body I just dub some similar colored material underneath (black works). This way you can control exactly the thickness of the body. I know of no other way short of tapering your herl strands to get a tapered body or any desired body thickness.