Decided to fish in nj this weekend. I always buy my stamp and license and hardley use it. I like to fish stretches that my father used to take me to out of tradition. I know the problems with the hatchery and such but that is know excuse for the fish that nj stocked. The rainbows they put in are pathetic! The fish were small beat up and most of the ones I caught mouths were already starting to turn black. I hope this is not the best nj has to offer this year. I finally got disgusted with these fish and went and caught a couple wild browns and brookies. Guess I'll be spending the rest of my trout season in pa or ny. I feel nj screwed us this year.

trico mike said:

Decided to fish in nj this weekend. I always buy my stamp and license and hardley use it. I like to fish stretches that my father used to take me to out of tradition. I know the problems with the hatchery and such but that is know excuse for the fish that nj stocked. The rainbows they put in are pathetic! The fish were small beat up and most of the ones I caught mouths were already starting to turn black. I hope this is not the best nj has to offer this year. I finally got disgusted with these fish and went and caught a couple wild browns and brookies. Guess I'll be spending the rest of my trout season in pa or ny. I feel nj screwed us this year.

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The hatchery has been in operation for 30 plus years and has produced millions of quality fish over that time. The fish in the fall are all good sized healthy fish. Through no fault of their own they suffered a setback this year and they acted quickly to fix the situation. I think you are overreacting you boob

I fished the Flatbrook this morning. I must say it was a bad day for stockies. I was surprised how few people there were in the stretch I was fishing. I saw 2 other guys all morning. They were flipping spinners but said they caught nothing. The fish wanted insects I could not keep them off the end of the line. (Literally) I lost count in the 20s. I was starting to get bored catching them. I was hoping to get through them so I could hook into some wild fish , but there were too many of them.


I caught some small ones also Mike. I also got a few decent fish too. What I don't like about them is; their front fins are destroyed.

Here are some pics. Most of the fish I caught were camera shy and escaped before I could snap a pic. Damm barbless hooks.

There is nothing at all different about this year's rainbows versus any other year's rainbows, FYI. You can say only that they were released about 4 weeks earlier which means they are slightly smaller on average, but only slightly. Any fish raised in a concrete raceway in tight quarters is going to have nubbies for fins:crap:

Shannon's will be (and already has been) privately stocking sections of the upper SBR and the Gorge with some much nicer fish from the Musky Trout Hatchery. Those on top of wild fish of all three species plus holdover fish should keep the average fly angler practicing C&R happy this year.

I think New Jersey has many more reasons to be ashamed than the crappy fish....Have you seen the property taxes!!!!!!!rotesta:

I know that a lot of people fish for stockies, and that as a license holder you"pay"for those fish... but I have a hard time taking complaints about the quality of stocked fish seriously.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

In all fairness, it was a ridiculously tough year for the hatchery and its workers. I'm sure many of them put in long, extra hours just to ensure that our great state and waters got some fish. In the enda trout is a beautiful fish and fishing is a beautiful sport. Catching, whether an "ugly" stockie or a wild trout is a bonus. Enjoy your time on the water as not many people on this earth know the beauty of fishing.

tomfly said:

I fished the Flatbrook this morning. I must say it was a bad day for stockies. I was surprised how few people there were in the stretch I was fishing. I saw 2 other guys all morning. They were flipping spinners but said they caught nothing. The fish wanted insects I could not keep them off the end of the line. (Literally) I lost count in the 20s. I was starting to get bored catching them. I was hoping to get through them so I could hook into some wild fish , but there were too many of them.




I caught some small ones also Mike. I also got a few decent fish too. What I don't like about them is; their front fins are destroyed.

Here are some pics. Most of the fish I caught were camera shy and escaped before I could snap a pic. Damm barbless hooks.

View attachment 10469View attachment 10470View attachment 10471View attachment 10472View attachment 10473View attachment 10474View attachment 10475View attachment 10476View attachment 10477View attachment 10478View attachment 10479

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Tom, I was there all day today. We shoulda got together.....you did waaay better than I did. I had to work for em today and didn't find a single wild fish.:crap:

And yes, I could not believe how few people were out.

What did you get them on?

Jon T said:

What did you get them on?

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Size 14 collard bead head prince. The collar is read dyed peacock herl wrapped behind the bead.

I don't understand the ho hum attitude from you guys about this topic. This stats takes our money and then when things go wrong we are the ones who get screwed. Why wasn't there a alternate plan in place if something like this arose. Obviously they knew it could happen because many other states have gone thru this already. It's typical nj wait till it's broken then scramble to fix it instead of thinking ahead and getting out front of a situation. I guess I'm pissed at this state because it always seems to be taking more money from sportsmen and giving less and less. The deer hunters on this site know all to well about the buck tag bullshit. Also my muzzleloader season used to be 21 days then it went to 14 last year they dropped it to 11,but I still pay the same amount of money but I get less opportunities to hunt. it is cheaper for me to hunt in pa as a non resident then in nj as a resident.

i stopped by the Pequest TCA sunday morning to observe the sh*t show... i didn't even get the waders on. anyone wants a good laugh go there! i wont recommend fishing it though, you might get clocked in the head with a sinker. I counted 16 guys stacked on-top of eachother from the bridge to the spillway. The Russians, Czechs, Poles and other meat gaming NJ ethnic groups were out in force. Rope stringers of barely legal fish full. Why the state drops regulations each spring on this TCA disgusts me. The place looked like the Salmon River in Fall. The only bright side i guess (other then the laughs) it keeps them all in one place for a time.

tomfly said:

Size 14 collard bead head prince

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I thought a collard was something you ate with ham hocks. But if you found a way to wrap collard greens on a hook, that would please Beetle in his quest to use plant based tying materials instead of killing animals for fur and feather.

trico mike said:

I don't understand the ho hum attitude from you guys about this topic. This stats takes our money and then when things go wrong we are the ones who get screwed. Why wasn't there a alternate plan in place if something like this arose. Obviously they knew it could happen because many other states have gone thru this already. It's typical nj wait till it's broken then scramble to fix it instead of thinking ahead and getting out front of a situation. I guess I'm pissed at this state because it always seems to be taking more money from sportsmen and giving less and less. The deer hunters on this site know all to well about the buck tag bullshit. Also my muzzleloader season used to be 21 days then it went to 14 last year they dropped it to 11,but I still pay the same amount of money but I get less opportunities to hunt. it is cheaper for me to hunt in pa as a non resident then in nj as a resident.

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The "other states that went through this already" went through it because their hatcheries were stream fed and not well fed like Pequest is. The Division put too much faith in that fact and it served them very well for the first 30 years being disease free. They didn't anticipate that a bird could have introduced it, so lesson learned.

As for your hunting statement, you're not being intellectually honest. I hunt both NJ and PA. I pay $72.25 for a NJ All-Around license that includes gun and archery hunting as well as my fishing license. For that amount, we can kill unlimited antlerless deer and up to 4 bucks without the need to purchase anything more than that (1 buck in fall bow and 2 during 6 Day shotgun and 1 during winter bow). For a non-resident PA hunting license with archery, it costs us $128.40 and we can kill exactly 1 buck and no does. I understand your point about the $28 buck tags for permits seasons (archery, muzzleloader and shotgun), but do you really need to kill 6 bucks each year on top of unlimited doe harvest? I buy my archery permit buck tag for the extra $28, but only so I can hunt the rut. I don't buy other buck tags because I'll fill my freezer with plentiful does and hold out for a decent buck if I get that chance at a nice one during early fall bow, fall bow, permit fall bow, winter bow or 6 Day shotgun season.

Although it makes complete sense, I've never thought of purchasing a license as something that entitles me to some sort of personal return. I have a lifetime fishing license in MN and have already purchased season passes in NY and NJ. Hopefully some kids under the age of 16 will catch some fish.

I'd like to see any group looking to improve the quality of our natural resources with FAT ass bank accounts -- wouldn't you??

This all coming from a guy who filed his taxes ten minutes ago and has a firm grasp on paying for bullshit...

Rusty Spinner said:

There is nothing at all different about this year's rainbows versus any other year's rainbows, FYI. You can say only that they were released about 4 weeks earlier which means they are slightly smaller on average, but only slightly. Any fish raised in a concrete raceway in tight quarters is going to have nubbies for fins:crap:

Shannon's will be (and already has been) privately stocking sections of the upper SBR and the Gorge with some much nicer fish from the Musky Trout Hatchery. Those on top of wild fish of all three species plus holdover fish should keep the average fly angler practicing C&R happy this year.

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good to know, i was planning on going to the gorge if i fish this upcoming weekend, have not been there since the fall....

trico mike said:

I don't understand the ho hum attitude from you guys about this topic. This stats takes our money and then when things go wrong we are the ones who get screwed. Why wasn't there a alternate plan in place if something like this arose. Obviously they knew it could happen because many other states have gone thru this already. It's typical nj wait till it's broken then scramble to fix it instead of thinking ahead and getting out front of a situation. I guess I'm pissed at this state because it always seems to be taking more money from sportsmen and giving less and less. The deer hunters on this site know all to well about the buck tag bullshit. Also my muzzleloader season used to be 21 days then it went to 14 last year they dropped it to 11,but I still pay the same amount of money but I get less opportunities to hunt. it is cheaper for me to hunt in pa as a non resident then in nj as a resident.

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I understand your point.....I get very frustrated with the government on many levels.......The stocking program and license costs are not one of them...The state usually does a great job stocking, I am finding this out more by the reduced number of fish available in some of my favorite spots on the SBR......granted, I would like to see them stop stocking some streams due to wild populations of fish, but that is politics, and I really hate politics.....anyway. I believe an unforeseen(that can be argued) circumstance has led to a crappy year for the Division of Wildlife...
If it goes on to next year? Then I will be pissed and start writing letters......and asking for refunds, and asking why they didn't have a plan, because the same shit just happened......

I might even call someone a bad name....:crap:

trico mike said:

I don't understand the ho hum attitude from you guys about this topic. This stats takes our money and then when things go wrong we are the ones who get screwed. Why wasn't there a alternate plan in place if something like this arose. Obviously they knew it could happen because many other states have gone thru this already. It's typical nj wait till it's broken then scramble to fix it instead of thinking ahead and getting out front of a situation. I guess I'm pissed at this state because it always seems to be taking more money from sportsmen and giving less and less. The deer hunters on this site know all to well about the buck tag bullshit. Also my muzzleloader season used to be 21 days then it went to 14 last year they dropped it to 11,but I still pay the same amount of money but I get less opportunities to hunt. it is cheaper for me to hunt in pa as a non resident then in nj as a resident.

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What's the big mystery you boob. It's a couple of years before things will normalize and since when do you get all worked up over stockies. I may not let you push my boat this year after all

I can see some of what the OP is saying. Some spots on the musky I caught one seriously ugly fish after another after another, and I mean U G L Y. Other sec. though the fish were what you'd expect and on the BFB I was very impressed with the quality of the fish.

Check out these BFB bows my boys caught opening day.

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sunsignarcher said:

I can see some of what the OP is saying. Some spots on the musky I caught one seriously ugly fish after another after another, and I mean U G L Y. Other sec. though the fish were what you'd expect and on the BFB I was very impressed with the quality of the fish.

Check out these BFB bows my boys caught opening day.

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Those are some nice pictures...looks like they are having fun...as far as Pequest spillway fish..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shDtJ99lT-U....Fast forward to :20 seconds...although it is all entertaining

trico mike said:

I don't understand the ho hum attitude from you guys about this topic. This stats takes our money and then when things go wrong we are the ones who get screwed. Why wasn't there a alternate plan in place if something like this arose. Obviously they knew it could happen because many other states have gone thru this already. It's typical nj wait till it's broken then scramble to fix it instead of thinking ahead and getting out front of a situation. I guess I'm pissed at this state because it always seems to be taking more money from sportsmen and giving less and less. The deer hunters on this site know all to well about the buck tag bullshit. Also my muzzleloader season used to be 21 days then it went to 14 last year they dropped it to 11,but I still pay the same amount of money but I get less opportunities to hunt. it is cheaper for me to hunt in pa as a non resident then in nj as a resident.

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Mike there is only on way to change this. Get people who do not vote out to the polls. Until that happens, you are going to have to suck it up just like the rest of us do.

lightenup said:

I understand your point.....I get very frustrated with the government on many levels.......The stocking program and license costs are not one of them...The state usually does a great job stocking, I am finding this out more by the reduced number of fish available in some of my favorite spots on the SBR......granted, I would like to see them stop stocking some streams due to wild populations of fish, but that is politics, and I really hate politics.....anyway. I believe an unforeseen(that can be argued) circumstance has led to a crappy year for the Division of Wildlife...
If it goes on to next year? Then I will be pissed and start writing letters......and asking for refunds, and asking why they didn't have a plan, because the same shit just happened......

I might even call someone a bad name....:crap:

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I agree with you on most of your points. And I do think this mishap could lead eventually to some positive changes in the way the state stocks in the future. I'd like the see the upper SBR not stocked from Budd Lake to the bottom of the Claremont stretch at the very least. With all the wild fish in that section, all the Division needs is to put WTS regs in place like they did for the upper Pequannock. The upper river is only stocked in a few locations and those locations invite stringer fillers to kill wild fish as well as stockies. Other streams that are full of wild fish should also permanently be left alone and not see any more stockings. Most of these stockings into our TP waters are remnants from decades of previous stockings and are no longer needed, IMO. This year's issues at Pequest might be a good thing in having these discussions with the biologists and with the F&G Council.

For the non-hunters, the Rockport Game Farm where they raise pheasants had most of their pens collapse under a heavy snow a few years ago and at least 1/3 of the birds escaped along the upper Musky. Pheasant hunters were pissed at the fewer birds stocked that year. The next year after the pens were rebuilt with new nets and infrastructure, it turned out that they didn't have enough ventilation and disease wiped out a large number of birds. Hence they reacted to one issue only to find a second issue that, while different, also caused fewer birds to be stocked for a second year in a row. Last fall they worked out all the kinks and raised a ton of birds and hunters were happy once again. So it is entirely possible that unforeseen mistakes will be made with the best of intentions as they go about dealing with furunculosis.

At the end of the day, it should always come down to habitat over hatchery. That's the most critical lesson we keep missing......and hence we keep stocking mutant trout (and pheasants) instead of improving habitat and limits where wild trout (and grouse and woodcock) should be thriving.

Rusty, on the issue of deer hunting. Where I hunt I need all the season's to get one or two good opportunities to kill a good buck. I don't shoot does because the population has been way down the last 10 years. I only want to kill one or two bucks a year but haven't shot one in nj for 3years. I get mad that the state takes days away from my seasons. I like to spend as much time in the woods as possible. I really don't care if I kill anything. With all the fees for hunting I would think njcould to do some type of land management. I hunt in the pine barrens, the roads are horrible and this is the first year in many that I saw a lot of deer. I would usually be happy seeing20 all year. I hope they faired well this harsh winter. Mac, I don't want to float till it gets down to about 200 cfs. I need the workout.

trico mike said:

Rusty, on the issue of deer hunting. Where I hunt I need all the season's to get one or two good opportunities to kill a good buck. I don't shoot does because the population has been way down the last 10 years. I only want to kill one or two bucks a year but haven't shot one in nj for 3years. I get mad that the state takes days away from my seasons. I like to spend as much time in the woods as possible. I really don't care if I kill anything. With all the fees for hunting I would think njcould to do some type of land management. I hunt in the pine barrens, the roads are horrible and this is the first year in many that I saw a lot of deer. I would usually be happy seeing20 all year. I hope they faired well this harsh winter. Mac, I don't want to float till it gets down to about 200 cfs. I need the workout.

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If it's any consolation, I do know that the Game Committee is looking at changing up the deer permit fees and the Division staff seems to agree and for the better for hunters. IMO, they got too greedy with all the $28 permits. I'm not privy to their discussions, but I did like that they put out an online deer hunting survey recently for hunter input. I don't have to tell you how difficult it is to manage deer in NJ. In the big woods where you and I hunt (you in the Pines and me in the Highlands), deer densities are lower than the habitat could support. But in the suburbs, at least where I live, the herds are completely out of control from a lack of hunting. And often that happens within the same deer management zones. I hunt a property I manage in Sparta in Z6 adjacent to a nearly 4,000 acre WMA and our deer densities are well under 20 deer/square mile. Yet about 2 miles away, I participated in a cull hunt on a private golf course where we took 58 deer off it with just a few hunters (I shot 3 with a borrowed crossbow because of my surgery). Same management zone! I don't envy the biologists who have to deal with generalized management limits in zones that have both too few and too many deer.

Mike,
Did you attend the meeting about the NJ Trout Stocking Agenda at Centernary College a little while back?

Fredy

The disease at the hatchery this year was a setback for NJ F&W, but there are still plenty of opportunities to catch both wild and stocked trout in NJ. F&W has taken some reasonable steps to mitigate the stocking situation, and there will still be a stocking of 500k+ trout. More trout have been stocked in water that is strictly put and take and closer to populated areas, which in itself may be a reasonable long term pattern. And the idea of the upper SBR down to Long Valley as a WTS as mentioned by Rusty is a great idea - perhaps a year or two of no stocking may help this happen. And the new C&R on the Flatbrook, which has some wild brookies and browns, will only see rainbows for a while which have never been known to reproduce on the Flatbrook. Coupled with the no-kill regulations, the wild trout will not have stocked trout around to interbreed with which can hurt the wild strains. It will take at least several years, but we should see more and larger wild brookies and browns on that 4 mile stretch - I say stock rainbows only on the Flatbrook C&R as we monitor the progress of the wild trout over the next decade.

So this is not Armageddon, but a forced change in tactics by F&W from which we may learn some new ways to better the trout fishing. The staff at NJF&W is doing the best they can, and are dedicated professionals working to protect our wild trout fishery and also satisfy the anglers that want put and take fishing. If the design of the open runways allowed the infection of the trout of disease from bird droppings, I am confident that it will be mitigated and that more disease resistant trout will be sought to replace the current cultured browns and brook trout at Pequest.

Speaking as a NJ resident, the cost of the fishing license and trout stamp is still a bargain, providing plenty of wild trout opportunities (if you take the time to look), plenty of stocked and hold over trout on some waters with great hatches, and more than enough stocked trout on marginal waters to satiate the meat anglers. We have lost some waters in NJ due to development, but quality trout fishing opportunities in NJ are better than 50 years ago, and for those of us in North Jersey, less than a hour away.

One last comment, those of us who do the majority of our trout fishing on small - mid sized trout streams for wild fish know that you have to add stealth to your fishing arsenal. As wild trout populations in waters like the SBR, Flatbrook, Pequonnack, and Wanaque hopefully rebound, expect a different challenge.

trico mike said:

Decided to fish in nj this weekend. I always buy my stamp and license and hardley use it. I like to fish stretches that my father used to take me to out of tradition. I know the problems with the hatchery and such but that is know excuse for the fish that nj stocked. The rainbows they put in are pathetic! The fish were small beat up and most of the ones I caught mouths were already starting to turn black. I hope this is not the best nj has to offer this year. I finally got disgusted with these fish and went and caught a couple wild browns and brookies. Guess I'll be spending the rest of my trout season in pa or ny. I feel nj screwed us this year.

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Im trying to read your post but I just keep hearing this and lose focus......

Twism said:

Im trying to read your post but I just keep hearing this and lose focus......

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The "losing focus" thing is probably because of your Asperger's...

Of all the things that suck about NJ, our DFW and the trout stocking program don't even register. From the time Pequest opened up until this year the fish have always been fine. You have to go back to the last days of Hayford to remember bad stockies. Besides I thought not many here cared about stockers???? Hmmmm, the tune has changed a bit when the stockers aren't as heavily stocked....