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  1. #37
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by Trout Nazi View Post
    First of all, I said nothing of the sort, I offerred an observation, that you got all butt-hurt over. I didn't kwow that I'm not allowed have an opinion, sorry, but my opinion has not changed.

    And your right, I don't know all of the intracacies and details. But I do get the big picture objective of both fishermand and NYC. You will be arguining this flow issue forever because your goals are philsophically different that those of NYC. They want to ensure enough water for 10 million people, and to a much lesser degree, flood protection. We fisherman want better fishing. Having enough drinking water fundamentally means not letting it go, and therein lies the issue. The needs of people will always outweigh the needs of fish. I do not foresee a solution that will satsify everyone. Throw politics into the mix, and its even less likely. If it weren't for that Montague number (driven by drinking water needs), we'd be fishing for sunnies in the summer. And if there ever was a drought that severe in duration, I don't doubt for a second that they'd turn the taps off everywhere but where that Montague number needed to be met.

    And I am a guide now (plus I know guides way more knowledgeable than you two, and who are also smart enough not to involved in these online battles).
    I have not been involved with any of the groups that are battling for more water for about 9 years now.Do I see an end to it, no never.50 years from now it'll just be different names and faces, and there still will not be enough water for what the Fisherman would like.Thats a reality.

    As i've said thousands of times when you have 4 state government entities plus NYC, there is just now way to Negotiate a viable deal for the Fly-Fisherman...When there is water the fishery is amazing, you could float and spread out..

    If your a guide you should know that.What's really entertaining is that you act like a 10 year old," my friends are better than your friends" who really gives a shit Whah whah whah.

    A tip for you and your clients -You should you stay out well after dark instead of Lydias, you'll catch more fish.


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  3. #38
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by TR View Post
    --------

    Morning Joey Tut.

    'Tis true that many of the old salts have departed this board. Coz, Kenny, Bruce and a handful of others since word on the river is that this BB has become something akin to digital cesspool.

    Even The Big Old Spinner lurks the board from time to time between various real estate closings as well as trips to Trenton.

    At least that's where he says he going.

    However, you still have a handful of dudes that have plied the water for many years that still participate in the frivolity: Joe D., Brachy, TR and some others that use pen names -- not exactly chopped liver, eh?

    But as Obama has said many times:

    It is what it is.

    I think he said that. Maybe it was Romney.

    But I digress.

    And we now have The Trout Nazi (can't wait to see his logo on his driftboat and business cards this year -- still in production but word is is that it's a cross between a Simms like silohuette of a trout rising over an a skul and bones with an Iron Cross in a field of red, white and black, he's the newest UDR guide who is as regular on the board as a blue cheese burger at Lydia's and, in addition, we also have the venerable Beetle to lessen the pain.

    So, all is not lost as we anxiously await the beginning of yet another season on the Upper Delaware River.

    Kind regards and tight lines always,
    TR


    Attachment 10374

    what a great post!


  4. #39
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by JOE.T View Post
    I have not been involved with any of the groups that are battling for more water for about 9 years now.Do I see an end to it, no never.50 years from now it'll just be different names and faces, and there still will not be enough water for what the Fisherman would like.Thats a reality.

    As i've said thousands of times when you have 4 state government entities plus NYC, there is just now way to Negotiate a viable deal for the Fly-Fisherman...When there is water the fishery is amazing, you could float and spread out..

    If your a guide you should know that.What's really entertaining is that you act like a 10 year old," my friends are better than your friends" who really gives a shit Whah whah whah.

    A tip for you and your clients -You should you stay out well after dark instead of Lydias, you'll catch more fish.
    Ok, so we had to take the super long way around, sprinkle in a few insults, for you to pick up what I was putting down. Who exactly is acting like the 10yr old?

    And we stay out way after dark, this isn't a float till 6 operation like they do out west. Who doesn't float till way after dark?

    Roll up the windows Brian, you're letting the stank out.

  5. #40
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by JOE.T View Post
    I have not been involved with any of the groups that are battling for more water for about 9 years now.Do I see an end to it, no never.50 years from now it'll just be different names and faces, and there still will not be enough water for what the Fisherman would like.Thats a reality.

    As i've said thousands of times when you have 4 state government entities plus NYC, there is just now way to Negotiate a viable deal for the Fly-Fisherman...When there is water the fishery is amazing, you could float and spread out..

    If your a guide you should know that.What's really entertaining is that you act like a 10 year old," my friends are better than your friends" who really gives a shit Whah whah whah.

    A tip for you and your clients -You should you stay out well after dark instead of Lydias, you'll catch more fish.
    This is what happens and why knowledgable people that have fished and lived on the system no longer come here.
    All I initially posted were links to help with making a decision to people considering coming up here so they can look at real time variables before making the slog up here and it , as usual turns into a shitstorm of unrelated bullshit.

    In addition, I get asked literally thousands of times a year on who dictates releases, how did it evolve, who controls the valves etc, so I posted a link to the current flow plan so that maybe if you were interested, you might take some time and delve into it. You would benefit more than you think.

    I think it's a freakin sin that if you dont know shit about the system that you even come up and fish. And a much bigger sin is to fish the system and not support FUDR, the only group that is watching out for everyone's interest. Some great work has been done with plenty more on the horizon but it also takes memberships. I feel that if you fish up here on a regular basis and dont spend the measly $35.00 annual membership, then you are just an asshole.

    This will be my 21st year guiding on this system and have seen a ton of changes, some good, some horrible, but as a group and a viable conservation org. looking out the rivers interest, $35.00 is a bargain. Go to the One Bug Banquet in Fireman's Field on Friday, April 25th at 7:00 and you will be shocked at how many National organizations support our cause, plus there is a banquet with open bar and both silent and regular auctions and free insight into how the system worked.

    Before I commit to a 2 or 3 hour drive, I for one would want to know how an upcoming storm can affect my fishing, where I can go to avoid it, how it will affect the flows. It is a big system and with some knowledge, can be fished any time of year.

    And here is a free trip before the season starts. NPS, NYDEC and PA Fish and Boat are all going to be riding herd this year for violations and illegal guiding. The last few years with state budget cuts have reduced staff and people have taken advantage of it, but in my recent conversations with all 3 entities, the party is over. If you float, you better have enough life preservers, whistles, lights and of course proper permits and NO glass containers plus your appropriate fishing licenses and if you are a guide, all permits, PA, NY and NPS plus the proper amount of insurance on hand to prove and all safety certifications, including: adult, child and infant CPR, First Aid, Water Safety and it might be a good idea to know how to row a boat.

    Oh and most important, centerpinning which shouldnt even be legal, for stacked up fish seeking thermal protection will be dealt with harshly, maybe not by an officer of the court, but by plenty of others who arent restrained by the legal system.


  6. #41
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by Trout Nazi View Post
    Ok, so we had to take the super long way around, sprinkle in a few insults, for you to pick up what I was putting down. Who exactly is acting like the 10yr old?

    And we stay out way after dark, this isn't a float till 6 operation like they do out west. Who doesn't float till way after dark?

    Out west, now your insulting the guides out there.Wow
    Next time think twice about taking the first swing

    None of my posts where directed at you, you came at me for whatever reason..Which really doesn't mean shit to me.
    See you on the river.


  7. #42
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by brachycentrus View Post
    This is what happens and why knowledgable people that have fished and lived on the system no longer come here.
    All I initially posted were links to help with making a decision to people considering coming up here so they can look at real time variables before making the slog up here and it , as usual turns into a shitstorm of unrelated bullshit.
    You can't be serious.
    The unrelated bullshit started in post #3 and continued in #6 and #9. those posts got a few others in on it...

    YOU started the "shit storm" that you are complaining about!

    John
    Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.--Henry David Thoreau

  8. #43
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by JOE.T View Post
    Out west, now your insulting the guides out there.Wow
    Next time think twice about taking the first swing.
    So you're saying that its not common practice out west to float until early evening, is that it? They float till 11 at night like we do out here, putting in 14-15hr days for their clients?

    Why don't you all go back to fighting over who gets to be the Lorax of the Delaware.

    Roll up the windows Brian, you're letting the stank out.

  9. #44
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by brachycentrus View Post
    Oh and most important, centerpinning which shouldnt even be legal, for stacked up fish seeking thermal protection will be dealt with harshly, maybe not by an officer of the court, but by plenty of others who arent restrained by the legal system.
    Can you elaborate on this? Who will be policing this and who is above the law? I think without a doubt that it should be enforced, just intrigued by the logistics/definitions.


  10. #45
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by Trout Nazi View Post
    So you're saying that its not common practice out west to float until early evening, is that it? They float till 11 at night like we do out here, putting in 14-15hr days for their clients?

    Why don't you all go back to fighting over who gets to be the Lorax of the Delaware.
    Not the guides I know in Montana Josh Steinmentz,Gary Frits and the Gang at headhunters fly-shop on the Mo..Your clueless

    Your a guide ? For who?

    I know every guide by first name from the DRC, WB Angler, Coz' Crew, Lee Hartman, TR,JOE.D , The guys from the Catskillflies, among others.Your nothing more than a wannabe.

    I'll find out who you are and let the whole world know online, that should help boost your new start up Business .Oh don't worry you'll thank me for the all customer's that i'll send your way.Remember like attracts like, clueless fly-fisherman…

    Maybe Future Fanatic will be your first customer.

    Just shoot me a PM and I'll help dial you in with locations and flies..Before you shoot your mouth off why don't you call a few shops and ask if they know me.I've done more to help the river's.spend money at the shops, and refer people to guides and the shops than you could ever imagine.

    I'm good the good guy on the Delaware you jerk off.

    Like I said earlier can't wait to see you on the river,

    It's guys like you that give guides a bad rap.


  11. #46
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by Thursthouse View Post
    Can you elaborate on this? Who will be policing this and who is above the law? I think without a doubt that it should be enforced, just intrigued by the logistics/definitions.
    Well. I will give an example of the carnage that can occurr. A guide from down in the Poconos took his clients to a thermal refuge where the trout are stacked up like cordwood at certain times of the year. He and his clients were pinning with waxworms and had the balls to put on his website that the fishing was so good, that they whacked something like 86 fish and went back the next day for another 50 0r 60 or so. That, especially from someone who professes to be a guide is in no way ethical on this system. These fish are gems, wild trout and should be respected for what they represent. I know this location well and have never stopped there with a client and be a hero for a day. There are other areas on the system where the fish stack up like that. I never stop with clients because tomorrow, I would see them there. It is a natural protection zone and pisses me off to no end that NYDEC and PA does not protect these areas. They offer more protection to a hatchery system, the Beaverkill, where they close off Horton Brook area for the same reason, but wont do anything to protect the wild stock.
    Centerpinning in the hands of a good pinner is deadly and is more conducive to migratory fish like up on the Salmon or Great Lake tribs, not for wild trout on the Delaware. It's just not fair or sporting and lacks ethics and these fish face enough challenges both natural and man made.
    John, as far as you pointing out who is starting shit and pointing to pages or posts, like I said before, I just dont like you and you evoke that response from me.
    Trout Nazi, I think we talked over the winter when I was selling my boat, I can be mistaken, but I wish you luck and hope you enjoy your choice. It will at times make you wish you had your gun and at the same time be thankful that you dont, but the beauty and joy that you can experience more than make up for it.
    Joe T. is solid and knows his shit. Do a search on this site and read a couple of articles he used to contribute. Good fisherman and knows his bugs and thats what it's all about.
    Enjoy and Good Luck TN.


  12. #47
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by brachycentrus View Post
    Well. I will give an example of the carnage that can occurr. A guide from down in the Poconos took his clients to a thermal refuge where the trout are stacked up like cordwood at certain times of the year. He and his clients were pinning with waxworms and had the balls to put on his website that the fishing was so good, that they whacked something like 86 fish and went back the next day for another 50 0r 60 or so. That, especially from someone who professes to be a guide is in no way ethical on this system. These fish are gems, wild trout and should be respected for what they represent. I know this location well and have never stopped there with a client and be a hero for a day. There are other areas on the system where the fish stack up like that. I never stop with clients because tomorrow, I would see them there. It is a natural protection zone and pisses me off to no end that NYDEC and PA does not protect these areas. They offer more protection to a hatchery system, the Beaverkill, where they close off Horton Brook area for the same reason, but wont do anything to protect the wild stock.
    Centerpinning in the hands of a good pinner is deadly and is more conducive to migratory fish like up on the Salmon or Great Lake tribs, not for wild trout on the Delaware. It's just not fair or sporting and lacks ethics and these fish face enough challenges both natural and man made.
    100% agree that that's a direct abuse of the resource and appreciate your professionalism in holding true to you morals. I guess I was more interested in who "dealt" with such offenders and more importantly how are they "above the law". Full disclosure: I'm new to the hobby so this may be a bonehead question.


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  14. #48
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    Re: NY State Role in Reservoir Releases

    Quote Originally Posted by JOE.T View Post
    Not the guides I know in Montana Josh Steinmentz,Gary Frits and the Gang at headhunters fly-shop on the Mo..Your clueless

    Your a guide ? For who?

    I know every guide by first name from the DRC, WB Angler, Coz' Crew, Lee Hartman, TR,JOE.D , The guys from the Catskillflies, among others.Your nothing more than a wannabe.

    I'll find out who you are and let the whole world know online, that should help boost your new start up Business .Oh don't worry you'll thank me for the all customer's that i'll send your way.Remember like attracts like, clueless fly-fisherman…

    Maybe Future Fanatic will be your first customer.

    Just shoot me a PM and I'll help dial you in with locations and flies..Before you shoot your mouth off why don't you call a few shops and ask if they know me.I've done more to help the river's.spend money at the shops, and refer people to guides and the shops than you could ever imagine.

    I'm good the good guy on the Delaware you jerk off.

    Like I said earlier can't wait to see you on the river,

    It's guys like you that give guides a bad rap.
    Big deal, you know 3 guys in Montana who are the exception to the rule. The name dropping does not impress me.

    Im a guide for myself, independent business. Maybe you'll see me on the Main in my motor canoe, I save the drifter for the branches. As far as knowing who you are, I could care less. Your another one of the negative know it alls who feels its their duty to lecture the rest of us idiots. It's all good until someone questions though (which I didn't even do).

    Roll up the windows Brian, you're letting the stank out.

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