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  1. #25
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by MACFLY View Post
    You and I both know that the level of on book and off book debt means we can't grow our way out of this alone. Clearly not stating taxes should be raised yet but they will need to be raised if we are serious about paying off the debt. Now the question remains will the govt use those taxes to retire debt or just spend it.
    But, we can't tax our way to prosperity either.

    Hell no and it aint over now.......

  2. #26
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by Trouser Trout View Post
    But, we can't tax our way to prosperity either.
    No we can't but let's be realistic. We are a long way from prosperity.we need to get the economy going, then cut spending then raise taxes when the convoy is stable. Trust me I'm the last guy that wants my taxes raised I just hope we can stabilize things enough to address the larger debt issue.

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  3. #27
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by MACFLY View Post
    No we can't but let's be realistic. We are a long way from prosperity.we need to get the economy going, then cut spending then raise taxes when the convoy is stable. Trust me I'm the last guy that wants my taxes raised I just hope we can stabilize things enough to address the larger debt issue.
    Mac, we have a spending problem not a revenue problem. We collect too much in taxes as it is. Damn that is one pretty trout......

    Hell no and it aint over now.......

  4. #28
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by Trouser Trout View Post
    Mac, we have a spending problem not a revenue problem. We collect too much in taxes as it is. Damn that is one pretty trout......
    That's a party line TT. I'm really only interested in solving a problem. In this case a massive one. The kind of growth needed to bring n enough revenue to retire the debt would be abnormal in the range of 5-7% growth over a sustained period of time. As said we need to cut spending and get the economy going ASAp but to deal with long term structural debt taxes will go up. This assumes we an do the first 2 things which is going to be a challenge.

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  5. #29
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Mac, We already have the highest corporate tax rate in the industrialized world, the top 10 percent of earners already pay 71 percent of the federal tax. Who exactly should be paying more tax? We spend too much, we don't collect too little, the party line happens to be right this time. I think you are suffering from avatar envy. Entitlement programs account for 62 percent of the national budget, they have all grown in ways never originally intended, cut entitlements and fix the problem. We can also deport everyone who is here illegaly. Estimates are around 15 million people, who are a complete drain on they system. I get a good laugh at the obama administration's reluctance to enforce the the US constitution in this case. All persons who hold nationally elected office swear to uphold the laws of the US and the constitution, instead this boob fights them. The modern day democrat looks at the US constitution as a document to be worked around, rather than a document to be worked within. Which brings me to another point, since we know the federal govenment is abysmal at running programs as evidenced by their track record, why would anyone think they have the ability to manage health care?

    Hell no and it aint over now.......

  6. #30
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Well everyone will have to pay more taxes. That's a given. I think broadening the base is a must. Clearly we spend too much and as I said spending cuts across the board are coming. We just have a ridiculous structural imbalance that can't be dealt with through growth and speeding cuts. The kind of growth needed to bring in revenues always invites inflation. If you were to look at just the Medicare prescription plan that was enacted in 2005 the point is well illustrated. On the day TTwhat program kicked off we needed to have 8 trillion dollars invested in moderate growth vehicles to support the program overthe long haul we didn't have 8 trillion or billion or million or hell 8000.00 we put it on the card. So yeah we have a big spending problem but to suggest we an solve this forthe long haul without added tax revenues is disingenuous. And your response seems to indicate that I believe someone doesn't pay enough in taxes already. I can asure you as part of the 10% paying those taxes im in no hurry to pay more. As for suffering from avatar envy all I can say is mine is bigger


    Quote Originally Posted by Trouser Trout View Post
    Mac, We already have the highest corporate tax rate in the industrialized world, the top 10 percent of earners already pay 71 percent of the federal tax. Who exactly should be paying more tax? We spend too much, we don't collect too little, the party line happens to be right this time. I think you are suffering from avatar envy. Entitlement programs account for 62 percent of the national budget, they have all grown in ways never originally intended, cut entitlements and fix the problem. We can also deport everyone who is here illegaly. Estimates are around 15 million people, who are a complete drain on they system. I get a good laugh at the obama administration's reluctance to enforce the the US constitution in this case. All persons who hold nationally elected office swear to uphold the laws of the US and the constitution, instead this boob fights them. The modern day democrat looks at the US constitution as a document to be worked around, rather than a document to be worked within. Which brings me to another point, since we know the federal govenment is abysmal at running programs as evidenced by their track record, why would anyone think they have the ability to manage health care?


    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  7. #31
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by MACFLY View Post
    Well everyone will have to pay more taxes. That's a given. I think broadening the base is a must. Clearly we spend too much and as I said spending cuts across the board are coming. We just have a ridiculous structural imbalance that can't be dealt with through growth and speeding cuts. The kind of growth needed to bring in revenues always invites inflation. If you were to look at just the Medicare prescription plan that was enacted in 2005 the point is well illustrated. On the day TTwhat program kicked off we needed to have 8 trillion dollars invested in moderate growth vehicles to support the program overthe long haul we didn't have 8 trillion or billion or million or hell 8000.00 we put it on the card. So yeah we have a big spending problem but to suggest we an solve this forthe long haul without added tax revenues is disingenuous. And your response seems to indicate that I believe someone doesn't pay enough in taxes already. I can asure you as part of the 10% paying those taxes im in no hurry to pay more. As for suffering from avatar envy all I can say is mine is bigger
    As the economy grows everyone will pay more taxes as their earnings increase and the unemployed go back to work, I just don't agree that we need to raise anyone's rate.

    Hell no and it aint over now.......

  8. #32
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Starting to sound like GST's off topic forum over here

    We need a leader right now. Obama has not been that guy. Time will tell if Mitt can be that guy. But we can't fix what's broken if only one party is brought to the table.

    A sinking fly is closer to Hell - ​Unknown

  9. #33
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    I find it ironic that folks who don't want taxes raised on the wealthy point out that the upper 10% pay 71% of income taxes. They fail to realize that this only serves to point out the income equality gap between the rich and everyone else, especially since, through the use of loopholes and tax shelters, they pay a lower rate than the rest of us.


  10. #34
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by fishhead View Post
    I find it ironic that folks who don't want taxes raised on the wealthy point out that the upper 10% pay 71% of income taxes. They fail to realize that this only serves to point out the income equality gap between the rich and everyone else, especially since, through the use of loopholes and tax shelters, they pay a lower rate than the rest of us.
    Another liberal shows his true colors

    What, exactly, is wrong with being rich? Who said that in a free, democratic, capitalist society that we should strive for income equality??? Therein lies the true problem. Some folks feel income is "owed to them". You have the same rights in the US to make as much $$ as you want within the law. Nobody is stopping you from increasing your wealth if that is what you want in life.

    A sinking fly is closer to Hell - ​Unknown

  11. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Rusty Spinner For This Useful Post:

    lightenup (10-22-2012), Lonewolve (10-24-2012), MACFLY (10-22-2012), tomfly (10-22-2012), Trouser Trout (10-22-2012)

  12. #35
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    A
    Quote Originally Posted by Trouser Trout View Post
    As the economy grows everyone will pay more taxes as their earnings increase and the unemployed go back to work, I just don't agree that we need to raise anyone's rate.
    Yes I understand the principle of a rising tide lifts all boats. However we are headed for a tsunami of fiscal problems. Some more immediate then others. Just the possibility of a downgrade Of credit rating this year presents the nightmare scenario for our country. Time will tell!!!

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  13. #36
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    Re: Presidential Candidate Q & A on Recreational Fishing

    Quote Originally Posted by fishhead View Post
    I find it ironic that folks who don't want taxes raised on the wealthy point out that the upper 10% pay 71% of income taxes. They fail to realize that this only serves to point out the income equality gap between the rich and everyone else, especially since, through the use of loopholes and tax shelters, they pay a lower rate than the rest of us.

    I'm not suggesting that taxes be raised only on the wealthy? I'm certainly not saying they should be raised now. I would be very careful asserting the rich get all the breaks. TT is correct that the top 10% pay most of the taxes. The notion that they should pay more because of some imbalance in our economy is based on a concerted effort to put Americans against each other. Who are the rich to you? How is this defined. If all these loopholes are enabling them to pay less taxes how come they still account for such a high percentage of what is paid. If this is about fairness how is it that 48% pay no federal income tax at all. Our single largest line item in the federal budget is for means tested welfare programs which now tops 1 trillion dollars. So while it's a great populist message to say tax the rich it's the kind of divisive leadership that is creating a horrible situation for our nation.

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  14. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to MACFLY For This Useful Post:

    lightenup (10-22-2012), Rusty Spinner (10-22-2012)

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