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  1. #1
    TR's Avatar
    TR is offline "You can observe a lot just by watching." Y. Berra
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    Exclamation ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Good morning and Happy Father's Day...

    An article from The Scranton Times Tribune newspaper this morning:

    {Pullquote from article:


    "Nobody's going to believe that they're good guys when they're blowing up people's houses and poisoning their wells."

    ~ Robert F. Kennedy}


    TROUBLED PROMISE: Little oversight, looming problems for Pa. gas industry

    http://bit.ly/b0KtJt


  2. #2
    Bob K. is offline Fishizzle, I use worms but I'm looking to upgrade!
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    The same article was in the Sunday June 20, 2010 "Citizen's Voice" published in Wilkes Barre. Did you read the accompaning article about the businessman trucker who lives on Bowman's Creek who now has permission to draw hundreds of thousands of gallons of water from it for use by the drillers in the Fracing procedure?

    Here is today's follow up article:

    Danger spills over well sites - News - Citizens Voice

    "Hundreds of violations reported over the past 5 years."


    To bad nobody on this website from New York and New Jersey reads about the problems the Gas Industry is causing in PA! But then, it isn't in your back yard is it?

    Wait till it starts in the Catskill's. When they start withdrawing water from the Beaverkill, or the Esopus, or the Neversink for the Fracing!

    Of course, you can always go fishing in Patagonia or New Zealand! Or maybe you can arrange for a day on the Test or the Itchen! How about that? Sounds good, doesn't it!

    Bob K.


  3. #3
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob K. View Post
    The same article was in the Sunday June 20, 2010 "Citizen's Voice" published in Wilkes Barre. Did you read the accompaning article about the businessman trucker who lives on Bowman's Creek who now has permission to draw hundreds of thousands of gallons of water from it for use by the drillers in the Fracing procedure?

    Here is today's follow up article:

    Danger spills over well sites - News - Citizens Voice

    "Hundreds of violations reported over the past 5 years."


    To bad nobody on this website from New York and New Jersey reads about the problems the Gas Industry is causing in PA! But then, it isn't in your back yard is it?

    Wait till it starts in the Catskill's. When they start withdrawing water from the Beaverkill, or the Esopus, or the Neversink for the Fracing!

    Of course, you can always go fishing in Patagonia or New Zealand! Or maybe you can arrange for a day on the Test or the Itchen! How about that? Sounds good, doesn't it!

    Bob K.
    Scare tactics Bob...

    Do you think that the DEC would put these streams in Jeopardy?
    You are just hoping to scare the people who love these three streams.

    John
    Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.--Henry David Thoreau

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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Fanatic View Post
    Scare tactics Bob...

    Do you think that the DEC would put these streams in Jeopardy?
    You are just hoping to scare the people who love these three streams.
    Yeah and the Feds would never allow oil drilling to endanger the Gulf. The folks who worried were just trying to scare people. The fact that even the worst case expectations of environmental wackos have been far exceeded by the benevolent and generous BP conglomerate is just a coincidence.

    Statistically oil drilling is safe, after all only one well has failed, thousands of others are safe. The chances of getting hit by lightning are very small, of course if you are the one hit the consequences are fairly severe. Gas drilling is very safe, the mistakes in PA, WY, TX will never happen here......after all the drilling companies and FF have promised us it's safe.


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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Agust View Post
    Yeah and the Feds would never allow oil drilling to endanger the Gulf. The folks who worried were just trying to scare people. The fact that even the worst case expectations of environmental wackos have been far exceeded by the benevolent and generous BP conglomerate is just a coincidence.
    So, is what you are saying is that the DEC will allow companies to withdraw water from those three streams? I mean, that was what we were writing about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Agust View Post
    ...FF have promised us it's safe.
    You just like to make shit up, don't you?

    You're a liar.

    John
    Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.--Henry David Thoreau

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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Fanatic View Post
    You're a liar.
    Not exactly sure which of my statements you don't believe, but since I do not value your opinion at all, who gives a shit what you think.


    Agust


  7. #7
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Agust View Post
    Not exactly sure which of my statements you don't believe, but since I do not value your opinion at all, who gives a shit what you think.


    Agust
    Since you cared enough to read it AND post a reply...

    When I wrote "You're a liar" underneath your quote:

    "...FF have promised us it's safe."

    I did no such thing. I've said repeatedly that there will be accidents; I've repeatedly said that everyone should be pushing for the use of closed loop systems. I would NEVER PROMISE that it would be "safe".

    You may not care about my OPINION, but it seems you don't care about FACTS either.

    John
    Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.--Henry David Thoreau

  8. #8
    Bob K. is offline Fishizzle, I use worms but I'm looking to upgrade!
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Fanatic View Post
    Scare tactics Bob...

    Do you think that the DEC would put these streams in Jeopardy?
    You are just hoping to scare the people who love these three streams.
    You bet your sweet bippy I am!

    As Engineering Professor Anthony Ingraffia of Cornell U. said in the article below about W.VA. and PA: "you are the Guinea Pigs."

    http://citizensvoice.com/news/6-mont...blems-1.853862

    Bob K.


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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob K. View Post
    You bet your sweet bippy I am!

    As Engineering Professor Anthony Ingraffia of Cornell U. said in the article below about W.VA. and PA: "you are the Guinea Pigs."

    6-month investigation finds little oversight, looming problems - News - Citizens Voice

    Bob K.
    But what that quote means is that the "experiment" is done on the guniea pig so that any negative/positive effects of a procedure will be known and thus avoided/replicated, respectively...

    New York, learns from Pa and WV's mistakes...

    John
    Some circumstantial evidence is very strong, as when you find a trout in the milk.--Henry David Thoreau

  10. #10
    Bob K. is offline Fishizzle, I use worms but I'm looking to upgrade!
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Thanks John,
    I know it means that. Are you going to learn from it though?

    Here is today's installment from the Wilkes Barre "Citizen's Voice."

    Wastewater: A risky business - News - Citizens Voice

    http://citizensvoice.com/news/wastew...iness-1.858646

    http://citizensvoice.com/news/chemic...ebate-1.858645

    Cordially,
    Bob K.


  11. #11
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Fanatic View Post
    But what that quote means is that the "experiment" is done on the guniea pig so that any negative/positive effects of a procedure will be known and thus avoided/replicated, respectively...

    New York, learns from Pa and WV's mistakes...
    Which is pretty much what I've been saying regarding PA so could you please stop inferring that PA does have adequate oversight and drilling and disposal is being done here responsibly? Some is being done that way but I think we're seeing evidence that at least some of it isn't. It seems as though NY is definitely taking a more planned out approach but with the PADEP's established record on oversight and enforcement, the Keystone State is like the wild, wild west with these activities.

    TU Life Member, Forks of the Delaware Chapter

    NRA Life Member

    "Where the air's a little cleaner, the trees a little greener and the road don't go through your town."

  12. #12
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    Re: ="Troubled Promise - Little Oversight - Looming Problems"

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan R View Post
    Which is pretty much what I've been saying regarding PA so could you please stop inferring that PA does have adequate oversight and drilling and disposal is being done here responsibly? Some is being done that way but I think we're seeing evidence that at least some of it isn't. It seems as though NY is definitely taking a more planned out approach but with the PADEP's established record on oversight and enforcement, the Keystone State is like the wild, wild west with these activities.
    PA is seen by states like NJ as the wild west, in fact that's just the name we use when describing your state. PA's enforcement and oversight divisions pale by comparison to this state. Those I work with in river restoration and dam removals as well as friends who develop land in PA just to name a few areas where PADEP is involved, tell me it is far easier in PA due to what some see as lax rules with little or no oversight on projects. Not so for most other northeast states. I'm not sure to what extent being a Commonwealth affects that(?). My guess is this would tend to be the trend throughout that agency, and gas drilling permitting and oversight would not be any more intrusive into the private sector than the other divisions within PADEP are. When you're removing lots of old, obsolete small dams and you have some experience, running loose and fast is generally OK, but I'm not sure I want that approach when they're drilling on my neighbor's property that is uphill from my place if you know what I mean.

    A sinking fly is closer to Hell - ​Unknown

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