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  1. #25
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by CTobias View Post
    Not sure if any of you are aware of the "Climate Bill" that was rammed through congress. No one even got a chance to read the bill. Unless they are more than human and can read and understand a 1200 page bill in five hours. Some of you may argue that "Global Warming" is real and that we need to be "greener". Explain this then, why did arctic sea ice expand by 30% in the year since August 2007- August 2008?? Arctic Ice Grows 30 Per Cent In a Year Must be all that "global warming".

    This bill will only help make Al Gore rich and create a huge transfer of power and wealth. Buchanan: Climate Bill Is Transfer Of Wealth To World Government
    Going into this they KNEW this would create job losses in an already weak economy. This will cause companies to close and send more jobs over seas where there are no emission standards. This bill has already passed in congress and is headed to the senate. Every one needs to contact their senators and tell them to vote no on this bill. Unless of course you want to pay more for gas, electricity, and anything that produces a "carbon footprint".
    CT Tobias,

    When you speak of the "Climate Bill" I assume that you mean the "American Clean Energy and Security Act of 2009" which has been available on thomas.loc.gov (the Library of Congress Website) in one form or another since May 15th - over one month before it was "rammed through Congress" (actually, I'm pretty sure it was rammed through the House of Representatives - but why should we let the facts get us all confused). I think that one month is more than enough time to read 1200 pages. The moral of this story - if you care about this issue and want to stay informed don't rely on Rush, Buchanan and the rest of the right wing airbags. Instead, get out there and do some research for yourself. This bill was readily available to anyone that was interested.


  2. #26
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by BIGBOW View Post
    Its upsetting to see some members so anti any bill that would benefit the environment. Regardless if you buy into global warming or not, what's so bad about a bill that would help keep the planet cleaner? Taxes? Thats B.S. If it costs me a little more to do whats right for the world so be it. We know many of these emissions and pollutants have terrible long term impacts on the earth (who cares if its global warming or not), so why not take a look into better methods of living. I suppose theres no hole in the ozone either? If we leave things the way they are, will they get better or fix themselves? Some of you are the ones buying into a crock of shit! If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. Then there are those great people who will go against everything that their party does without thinking for themselves. Gotta love politics.
    Im pro environment...and anti government is the solution. You need only look at a couple pieces of this legislation to know how bad its going to be be for your wallet. So when you say you will pay a little more...it ends up being a lot more and its not just for one piece of legislation. In other words a little here and a little there adds up to a lot out of your wallet. One small example of this legislation that is troubling (there are many). In order to win voites from agriculture state congressman provisions were made to extend ethanol based fuels even though it has been proven that these fuels are not green and have implications for our food supply costs. So instead of seeking to reduce costs we will continue to pay farmers to grow crops to provide fuel that is not in our best interest. In PA next year the average utility bill will increase 10%..thats before any of this legislation is enacted...so be careful when you sign up to paying for the costs.

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  3. #27
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by catskill dick View Post
    CT Tobias,

    When you speak of the "Climate Bill" I assume that you mean the "American Clean Energy and Security Act of 2009" which has been available on thomas.loc.gov (the Library of Congress Website) in one form or another since May 15th - over one month before it was "rammed through Congress" (actually, I'm pretty sure it was rammed through the House of Representatives - but why should we let the facts get us all confused). I think that one month is more than enough time to read 1200 pages. The moral of this story - if you care about this issue and want to stay informed don't rely on Rush, Buchanan and the rest of the right wing airbags. Instead, get out there and do some research for yourself. This bill was readily available to anyone that was interested.
    Well lets get our facts straight..The bill was still being written when it was voted on by the house..That is a fact and its got nothing to do with right wing or left wing. Unfortunately, today you dont have anyone reporting the news you only have folks spouting their specific beliefs. You might also want to include in your post the fact that while this bill was being considered work on healthcare and a defense bill were being worked on. Unless you have sat in on committee meetings and worked with representatives on these bills its a little naive to sate unequivocally that you can read the whole bill. The average legislator will work a 12 hour day while in session. Given the political reality of campaigns today, He/she has to spend an inordinate amount of time and effort raising funds for reelection the minute they go into office. while they will work 12 hours a day (many work longer) their staffs will routinely put in the same amount of time.

    So If you care about an issue and want to be educated I say dont rely on Rush or Keith olberman or Sean Hannity or Rachel Maddow or Mark Levine or Chris Matthews. There are plenty of blowhards on either side of the aisle. First go read the constitution, the declaration of independence, and while your at it the Federalist Papers. You will then have at least a sense of the history of our great country.

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

  4. #28
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by MACFLY View Post
    Well lets get our facts straight..The bill was still being written when it was voted on by the house..That is a fact and its got nothing to do with right wing or left wing. Unfortunately, today you dont have anyone reporting the news you only have folks spouting their specific beliefs. You might also want to include in your post the fact that while this bill was being considered work on healthcare and a defense bill were being worked on. Unless you have sat in on committee meetings and worked with representatives on these bills its a little naive to sate unequivocally that you can read the whole bill. The average legislator will work a 12 hour day while in session. Given the political reality of campaigns today, He/she has to spend an inordinate amount of time and effort raising funds for reelection the minute they go into office. while they will work 12 hours a day (many work longer) their staffs will routinely put in the same amount of time.

    So If you care about an issue and want to be educated I say dont rely on Rush or Keith olberman or Sean Hannity or Rachel Maddow or Mark Levine or Chris Matthews. There are plenty of blowhards on either side of the aisle. First go read the constitution, the declaration of independence, and while your at it the Federalist Papers. You will then have at least a sense of the history of our great country.
    I have read the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence (not law) and the Federalist Papers (also not law - but boy-oh-boy do you Conservatives seem to think that they are), non of which are relevant to my post. I was trying to make the point that there was plenty of information available to follow this bill and be aware of its contents (and changes to its contents) during the month or so leading up to its passage by the House.


  5. #29
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by FishsEddie View Post
    Thread has me wondering...


    In general, do flyfishermen tend to be more liberal or more conservative?

    (In the current political definitions of those words, of course.)

    I for one am Libertarian. In today's government there is hardly a left or a right. They are all one in the same as clearly shown by the current administration carrying over many of the lasts programs. "I will pull all our troops out of Iraq!!" (and then send them to Afghanistan)

    Like was stated, a good majority of fisherman in general are moderate, but there are a few who can lean one way or the other. At the end of the day does it matter, not really. I have emailed and sent letters to senators and congress people, it does nothing. Unless you are a lobbyist with a butt load of money to contribute to their campaign, they could care less what you have to say. It's unfortunate and disgusting and Americans need to take back America.

    Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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  6. #30
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
    Mark Twain

    http://www.savebristolbay.org/

    REAL FRIENDS DON'T LET FRIENDS SPOON FEED

    http://www.roehard.com

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  7. #31
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by CTobias View Post
    I for one am Libertarian. In today's government there is hardly a left or a right. They are all one in the same as clearly shown by the current administration carrying over many of the lasts programs. "I will pull all our troops out of Iraq!!" (and then send them to Afghanistan)

    Like was stated, a good majority of fisherman in general are moderate, but there are a few who can lean one way or the other. At the end of the day does it matter, not really. I have emailed and sent letters to senators and congress people, it does nothing. Unless you are a lobbyist with a butt load of money to contribute to their campaign, they could care less what you have to say. It's unfortunate and disgusting and Americans need to take back America.
    CT, You Libertarian SNAGGER!

    I'm an ultra right wing conservative. No wonder I catch more Steelies than you.

    Cdog


  8. #32
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Corndog View Post
    I read this thread with discust.

    CT you're a SNAGGER for starting this thread!

    You are a snagger! Then don't read it SNAGGER!!! No pictures of skams, if I catch one, for you! I am keeping them all to myself!

    Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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  9. #33
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by CTobias View Post
    You are a snagger! Then don't read it SNAGGER!!! No pictures of skams, if I catch one, for you! I am keeping them all to myself!

    Yea yea I know...you will gut her for her eggs. SNAGGER!

    Cdog


  10. #34
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Let reason guide your judgement (or, the facts as we know them about global warming):

    Global Climate Change Impacts in the United States - Home


  11. #35
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by BIGBOW View Post
    Taxes? Thats B.S. If it costs me a little more to do whats right for the world so be it.....
    OK then you wont mind paying double for your gas or electric bill? How about more at the pump? I work at a job that is controled by the oil markets, and before this bill was even voted on we recieved a call from our supplier. They told us if the bill got passed, expect to pay .85 on the dollar more for liquid asphalt, or any oil based product.

    Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.
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  12. #36
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    Re: Global Warming a Hoax, don't worry you will still pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by catskill dick View Post
    I have read the Constitution, the Declaration of Independence (not law) and the Federalist Papers (also not law - but boy-oh-boy do you Conservatives seem to think that they are), non of which are relevant to my post. I was trying to make the point that there was plenty of information available to follow this bill and be aware of its contents (and changes to its contents) during the month or so leading up to its passage by the House.
    Actually what you did was make an assumption and I presented to you some facts in rebuttal. The bill was being re-written as it was passing through the house vote. Also you do what a lot of folks do when having a discussion. You ignore what doesn fit your view and then throw out labels. Conservatives/right wingers and conservatives do the same thing liberals etc... Never said that the federalist papers were law but are in fact a vital piece of our history as they give voice to what our FOUNDING FATHERS were thinking about. You know the guys that helped give birth to our country. If you have read all that and still feel comfortable with what is taking place in our government today than all I can say is GOD help us all!!!

    "Angling is extremely time consuming. That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane